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Author Topic: Beasts harder to play than humans?  (Read 9025 times)
Blue_Leader
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« on: February 04, 2008, 03:21:55 am »

i read alot on the forum how people talk about beast begin overpowered and easier to play than humans while some of that may be true it seems like the beast have alot harder time killing people if they are good at blocking and beast need to find ways to outwit the humans so they dont get blocked everytime and take a hit but beast get the advantage of beginable to move quickly in strats so they get their subs up faster im still a noob at this game so correct me if im wrong but this was on my mind  Smiley
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happyera
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« Reply #1 on: February 04, 2008, 03:44:11 am »

It might be hard with beast if you are new but if you are trained killer, no one can stop you.
For example, I dueled with 1 guy, his name was Thrall or something, so he was pwning everyone in human team. There were everyone (top human players) and he easily pwned them.

(I was spec Cheesy)
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a simple facade
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« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2008, 04:52:36 am »

Being an absolute hardcore beast player, I'll make my input:

Beasts are actually quite easy to play. A solo beast player that can utilize rabid well can completely lay waste to buildings and squadrons of humans with a few well-timed buffs. Beasts are always on the offensive since they can get to flags/mines quicker than humans leaving them always having to defend.

However, ANY melee beast player can be stopped by a human with good reflexes and knows how to spin block. But if there is someone sniping you with temp or piercing your blocks with surge, then the human will either buff or reloc in fear.

Then there's Sac. I don't understand why so many people (especially veterans) have to whine and complain about sac so much. IT IS PART OF THE GAME. If you go elec instead of mag for your first tech line, you deserve to lose. It isn't too hard to make a base that is sac proof that doesn't use towers to block off the shield (shielded towers are still easy to take down because they are two or three-shot killed by saccers).

Humans by far have the superior weapons. As a beast you can either be a melee beast or use a magic weapon. If you use melee,  you have no way to fight back against coilers other than getting close and getting 1000 v 1ed by the human army unless you buff... then they will all reloc like cowards.  Undecided If you use magic, then you have really no good way to use melee other than a one-time use frenzy crystal, maybe using mist, SS, or Snare. Also take note that beasts do not have meds and relocs with makes sniping with temp tough when you have three other guys shooting at you. Have you even tried to use blaze against normal units besides siege? It's a horrendous weapon since the flames travel slowly and consume a shitload of mana.

Compare this to humans, who do not lose anything with taking any ranged weapon. They still can use meds, they can still reloc, they can still block, and can still hold other items with them.

Also, beasts do not have sensors unlike humans. This means that for beasts, the game can end in seconds with a sneak garr that will take out the lair in 8-10 secs. Worker scouts are very unreliable since they can be picked up by sensors and the comm must be extremely alert to notice the worker was gone.

This is why you don't see many "sneak subs" for beasts. First, beasts have to kill a nearby sensor, which anybody on humans can notice, and the comm will be certain to tell his team to send his team there. Even when the sneak sub goes up, summs don't even come close to the power of ballis. You have to first take out the shield and towers before you can even think of trying to get to the SH. A healing spire can't keep up with 8 ballis on the lair in comparison. A gate takes about 30 seconds to construct, and has paper-thin defenses. It is easily picked up by sensors and doesn't last long. The huge green beacons kinda obvious after the gate is up. Mortar towers also easily dispatch a gate before it can even go up.

Beasts have a LOT of flaws to them. They are not "cheap and broken" like most people claim them to be. Humans just require teamwork to win. Isn't that what savage is all about?
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Mr_Matt
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« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2008, 08:40:47 am »

Being an absolute hardcore beast player, I'll make my input:

Beasts are actually quite easy to play. A solo beast player that can utilize rabid well can completely lay waste to buildings and squadrons of humans with a few well-timed buffs. Beasts are always on the offensive since they can get to flags/mines quicker than humans leaving them always having to defend.

However, ANY melee beast player can be stopped by a human with good reflexes and knows how to spin block. But if there is someone sniping you with temp or piercing your blocks with surge, then the human will either buff or reloc in fear.

Then there's Sac. I don't understand why so many people (especially veterans) have to whine and complain about sac so much. IT IS PART OF THE GAME. If you go elec instead of mag for your first tech line, you deserve to lose. It isn't too hard to make a base that is sac proof that doesn't use towers to block off the shield (shielded towers are still easy to take down because they are two or three-shot killed by saccers).

Humans by far have the superior weapons. As a beast you can either be a melee beast or use a magic weapon. If you use melee,  you have no way to fight back against coilers other than getting close and getting 1000 v 1ed by the human army unless you buff... then they will all reloc like cowards.  Undecided If you use magic, then you have really no good way to use melee other than a one-time use frenzy crystal, maybe using mist, SS, or Snare. Also take note that beasts do not have meds and relocs with makes sniping with temp tough when you have three other guys shooting at you. Have you even tried to use blaze against normal units besides siege? It's a horrendous weapon since the flames travel slowly and consume a shitload of mana.

Compare this to humans, who do not lose anything with taking any ranged weapon. They still can use meds, they can still reloc, they can still block, and can still hold other items with them.

Also, beasts do not have sensors unlike humans. This means that for beasts, the game can end in seconds with a sneak garr that will take out the lair in 8-10 secs. Worker scouts are very unreliable since they can be picked up by sensors and the comm must be extremely alert to notice the worker was gone.

This is why you don't see many "sneak subs" for beasts. First, beasts have to kill a nearby sensor, which anybody on humans can notice, and the comm will be certain to tell his team to send his team there. Even when the sneak sub goes up, summs don't even come close to the power of ballis. You have to first take out the shield and towers before you can even think of trying to get to the SH. A healing spire can't keep up with 8 ballis on the lair in comparison. A gate takes about 30 seconds to construct, and has paper-thin defenses. It is easily picked up by sensors and doesn't last long. The huge green beacons kinda obvious after the gate is up. Mortar towers also easily dispatch a gate before it can even go up.

Beasts have a LOT of flaws to them. They are not "cheap and broken" like most people claim them to be. Humans just require teamwork to win. Isn't that what savage is all about?

wrong.

sac is mega powerful, and saying stuff like going elec is instant loss is retarded and it sucks that games are pretty much fire vs mag everygame

superior in what way? with beasts ammo-damage ratio they spawn empty mana respawn and theres not a lot you can do, just spectate a fag like tanglewood

reloc like cowards...

if you get hit with a sneak gar you suck

if someone is hugging a hill and you have melee and die, quit whining and take ranged instead

overall humans>beast by a mile, if beast didnt have leap... man they would suck even more
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Enliven
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« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2008, 10:26:46 am »

Beasts are easier to play at early stages of the game (ember, sac, tempest, frenzy) and harder on the later stages (coil, shield, flux, relo).
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MrEvil
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« Reply #5 on: February 04, 2008, 11:15:11 am »

Beasts are easier to play at early stages of the game (ember, sac, tempest, frenzy) and harder on the later stages (coil, shield, flux, relo).


For me it is easyer to play later with pred Wink.



beast is harder to play, 1 example is that most pug games are winning by hummys. Also with good hummys beast is harder but with bad hummys its easyer. I think everyone can be a good pred or hum if he have the skill for it Smiley.



« Last Edit: February 04, 2008, 11:18:04 am by EvO - MrEvil » Logged
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« Reply #6 on: February 04, 2008, 11:54:18 am »


Beasts<Humans? Get real. Beasts win 80% of the games, in CW's and in pugs aswell. So nowadays when humans loose they say "beast map".
« Last Edit: February 04, 2008, 12:09:53 pm by UnSaFe » Logged

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« Reply #7 on: February 04, 2008, 11:56:27 am »

Beasts are easier to play at early stages of the game (ember, sac, tempest, frenzy) and harder on the later stages (coil, shield, flux, relo).


For me it is easyer to play later with pred Wink.



beast is harder to play, 1 example is that most pug games are winning by hummys. Also with good hummys beast is harder but with bad hummys its easyer. I think everyone can be a good pred or hum if he have the skill for it Smiley.





The hardest part in Savage is your english  Cool Tongue


Both are quite easy if you know how to bash those ppls ^^
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MrEvil
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« Reply #8 on: February 04, 2008, 12:08:06 pm »

Jeah make a evilsuxenglishtopic but dont repeat and repeat you everytime k?
Back to topic!
« Last Edit: February 04, 2008, 12:10:05 pm by EvO - MrEvil » Logged
Notausgang
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« Reply #9 on: February 04, 2008, 12:53:21 pm »

Blue_Leader, as you can clearly see by the above answers the two races in Savage are hardly comparable; its a part of Savage's magic to have teams with such different abilities fight against each other and yet not make the game un-enjoyable due to imbalances. Wink
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Eclipse
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« Reply #10 on: February 04, 2008, 02:41:40 pm »

ARGH! HE DID IT! HE MENTIONED BALANCE!!! FIRE IN THE HOLE!!!
* Eclipse runs for cover
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AlphaFtw
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« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2008, 03:13:11 pm »

Yera, thrall a.k.a matax is a good blocker, but isn't THAT good. Snotling >>>>to the 10th power>> matax in beast melee. If you've seen matax's savage vid I'd have to judge that his beast melee is o.k. at the best. 


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rebbel
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« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2008, 03:29:17 pm »

n00bs point of view - it is easy to play if you got any idea what u r doing, despite the race. And u can adjust the diff by taking various goals. Running, and shooting at random folks will is never a good idea.

V easy - go kill those monkits!!!

Easy beastie:
Start with satlker/pred with carn, frenzy and shroud and hunt 4  nomads and avoid the big guys and u'll be all right as that is easy.
Easy hummie:
Pick a Savage, learn to block, grab a coil or a pulse and a few medkits and stick to a team / base - and u got an easy game.


Medium bestie:
Go and kill that big fat Lego alone in the dark... lone hummies are quite juicy and nourishing 4 preds
Grab a summie and go kill the shield
Grab a scav and lay a few mines by the enemy spawn points


Medium hummie:
Grab a nomad and build a front gra - scream 4 cover
Grab a balli and waste a few building, preds will soon notice u so u can practice shooting to some moving targets;)
Pick a Savage and go to capture the flag

Hard beastie:
Sack that shield boy!
Take a rabid and jump from enemy to enemy, and from hit to hit.
Take down that unshielded gar alone with you predclaws and few buffs

Hard hummie:
Grab a demo and demolish something, their tech preferably,
Grab a coil and guard the shield from summies - the survival of the tribe depends on u
take a reloc and see how far you can go into the enemy territory alone xD

Summary - IMHO savage has very flexible difficulty setting;)
« Last Edit: February 04, 2008, 03:31:32 pm by rebbel » Logged
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« Reply #13 on: February 04, 2008, 04:11:37 pm »

if you are going for killing, you will kill faster as beast, but its easier to play and less frustrating as humans (for me atleast)

but overall its quite balanced.
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Enliven
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« Reply #14 on: February 04, 2008, 04:17:39 pm »

Beasts are easier to play at early stages of the game (ember, sac, tempest, frenzy) and harder on the later stages (coil, shield, flux, relo).


For me it is easyer to play later with pred Wink.



beast is harder to play, 1 example is that most pug games are winning by hummys. Also with good hummys beast is harder but with bad hummys its easyer. I think everyone can be a good pred or hum if he have the skill for it Smiley.





I was talking about the team, not the individual players.
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