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Author Topic: Necro's Balance Changes + New content:)  (Read 1123 times)
Necrophiliac
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« on: April 16, 2020, 06:41:47 pm »

Since I fixed Savage and returned in October/November I've been compiling a list of changes to try and balance the game. At this current stage, beast is pretty shit to play and spectators are often just a long queue for Team 1. I don’t expect any of these changes to actually be made, it was more for fun than anything else. I put this in General discussions because you bastards locked new topics from being made in the suggestions section. None of these changes will make you better than me.

Team 1
Make it so humans have to reload when using Ammo. This will require the player switch to the ammo pack, instead of the ammo automatically being in the gun off spawn. Using the ammo will take 1 second and give the player 75% of the gun’s original amount, then it will be deleted from your inventory meaning you will have to buy it again after use. This is similar to mana crystal but you don’t have to throw it on the floor. This is too slow down rate of fire or shot spam.

Increase speed on Adrenaline Buff.

Chemical Weapons do more damage to buildings. Incin does more player damage too.

Electric Buff takes 1 second to charge meaning this should prevent block/elecing.

Relocator can’t be used whilst snared, price is also increased to 1K gold.

Human Siege loses the ability to eject and bali now costs 5.5k gold which is the same as summ. Bali is also given a forward sprint to try and promote aggression.

Shielded outpost has an option to either shield itself, or surrounding buildings and not both. Similar to how a commander can choose what guardian is used for. Shielded outpost also needs a 1k health reduction.


Team 2
Give Entropy buff use for 150. Gates rarely succeed and this gives commanders a choice.  A shield like buff that stops shots. Melee and items can still damage the unit.

Entropy weapons do more damage to buildings. Chaos bolt does more player damage too. Remove rupture’s splash damage effect because you can’t see shit.

Ophelia’s 5 is pretty much unused. I suggest her making a gate like structure, can be different in colour to stop confusion, which acts as a one way gate back to her base. 5 second construction time, 2 minute cooldown, 100 health and her not being able to use it herself should keep it balanced.

Ophelia’s orb heals other units for a small amount on direct hit. Her 4 should also require mana use which gradually builds up after she spawns, like summ. This stops people from spawning for 1 second, debuffing then going back to a normal unit.

Snares are reduced to 2 and have a long cast time, however they now have the ability to block relocs.

Frost bolts have reduced building damage.

Summoners are given a small sprint to promote attacking gameplay.

Behemoths are unable to capture spawn flags. They also have a mana use which gradually builds up after spawn to behe spawning.


Commanders and General
Self buffs are 100 per use, Comm buffs are 75 per use.
Longer cast on immob/snare or the ability to allow team-mates to shoot the immob/snare off. They’re far too easy to land.
Countdown on Demo and Sac. Easier to time, meaning less stalemates.
Human weapons to stop affecting the beast's movement. Flux often grounds people.
Ideally a New Building in order for you to get heroes. This means you have a way of disabling them as an opponent. (Like Sanctuary)
Allow commanders to see sensor range. (Circle around item, like shield)
Allow commanders to disallow items/units. MMB hinders the team.
Get rid of corpses quicker. Behe bodies stay on the floor for way too long.
Remove restrictions and spam from two players playing from same IP.
Allow commanders to get awards.
Increase in gold when siege hits buildings
Gold is automatically given to the player on kill. Siege kills don’t award gold for kill and ranged kills are given 50% gold on kill.
Remove Guardian from giving +100 Entro to balance the new entro buff
Remove Behemoth grounding human players.
Siege nerfs to both sides prevent them from capturing a spawn point.
Spawn protection is lost when a player melees/fires


Cosmetic, Out of game  and Map features:
Add on steam Smiley
Steam achievements.
Add game to discord activity.
More active social media
Display Discord, Facebook, Twitter and Reddit on Newerth.com.
Fluorescent mushrooms with different neon colours for map prop.
The “boomshrooms” added as an april fools could be a  respawnable map prop that gives users a small amount of health(250) when hitting. Respawn time 5 seconds.
Animated background for Front page (with option to turn it off)
Make a list of server changes and custom votes that have been made so returning players know what has changed. @drk
Someone add twitch emotes
New icons for end game awards.
Add Map Editor button into main menu
A flag that can be captured over time by proximity. (Savage resurrection)

Love Necro xoxoxoxo Smiley

















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snle anml
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« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2020, 11:52:36 am »

Hey. I like these ideas:

- having to reload to use ammo
- snare blocks reloc
- behe unable to catch flag
- 100 buff pool to use self buff

Not sure about the rest though )
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NoxX
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« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2020, 02:36:59 pm »

yeah the buff cost is nice.
maybe add a gold refund to elec and fire kills. like the refund when you get killed by siege, especially theres no counter play to block into elec, or get insta spawn killed by firebuff and elec buff.
about the charge time of elec, is it meat to be like that you cant do anything else while charging or can you charge it while blocking or even attacking? in this case a charge time woulb not make sense, imo. but maybe a try would show Smiley
anyway overall good points to talk about keep going  Afro Grin
Noxx
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Ghitler
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« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2020, 03:16:10 pm »

Team 1
Make it so humans have to reload when using Ammo. This will require the player switch to the ammo pack, instead of the ammo automatically being in the gun off spawn. Using the ammo will take 1 second and give the player 75% of the gun’s original amount, then it will be deleted from your inventory meaning you will have to buy it again after use. This is similar to mana crystal but you don’t have to throw it on the floor. This is too slow down rate of fire or shot spam.  -

Increase speed on Adrenaline Buff. +

Chemical Weapons do more damage to buildings. Incin does more player damage too. +

Electric Buff takes 1 second to charge meaning this should prevent block/elecing. -

Relocator can’t be used whilst snared, price is also increased to 1K gold. Snare yes, increase price no.

Human Siege loses the ability to eject and bali now costs 5.5k gold which is the same as summ. Bali is also given a forward sprint to try and promote aggression. lose eject - NO

Shielded outpost has an option to either shield itself, or surrounding buildings and not both. Similar to how a commander can choose what guardian is used for. Shielded outpost also needs a 1k health reduction. - NO


Team 2
Give Entropy buff use for 150. Gates rarely succeed and this gives commanders a choice.  A shield like buff that stops shots. Melee and items can still damage the unit. - NO

Entropy weapons do more damage to buildings. Chaos bolt does more player damage too. Remove rupture’s splash damage effect because you can’t see shit. +

Ophelia’s 5 is pretty much unused. I suggest her making a gate like structure, can be different in colour to stop confusion, which acts as a one way gate back to her base. 5 second construction time, 2 minute cooldown, 100 health and her not being able to use it herself should keep it balanced. NO

Ophelia’s orb heals other units for a small amount on direct hit. Her 4 should also require mana use which gradually builds up after she spawns, like summ. This stops people from spawning for 1 second, debuffing then going back to a normal unit. NO

Snares are reduced to 2 and have a long cast time, however they now have the ability to block relocs. YES

Frost bolts have reduced building damage. NO

Summoners are given a small sprint to promote attacking gameplay. YES

Behemoths are unable to capture spawn flags. They also have a mana use which gradually builds up after spawn to behe spawning. YES


Commanders and General
Self buffs are 100 per use, Comm buffs are 75 per use. YES
Longer cast on immob/snare or the ability to allow team-mates to shoot the immob/snare off. They’re far too easy to land.
Countdown on Demo and Sac. Easier to time, meaning less stalemates. YES
Human weapons to stop affecting the beast's movement. Flux often grounds people. NO
Ideally a New Building in order for you to get heroes. This means you have a way of disabling them as an opponent. (Like Sanctuary) NO
Allow commanders to see sensor range. (Circle around item, like shield) YES
Allow commanders to disallow items/units. MMB hinders the team. YES
Get rid of corpses quicker. Behe bodies stay on the floor for way too long. YES YES YES
Remove restrictions and spam from two players playing from same IP. YES
Allow commanders to get awards. YES
Increase in gold when siege hits buildings YES
Gold is automatically given to the player on kill. Siege kills don’t award gold for kill and ranged kills are given 50% gold on kill. YES
Remove Guardian from giving +100 Entro to balance the new entro buff YES
Remove Behemoth grounding human players. YES
Siege nerfs to both sides prevent them from capturing a spawn point. YES
Spawn protection is lost when a player melees/fires YES


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Badyyy
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« Reply #4 on: April 28, 2020, 12:11:37 am »

are we really trying to get it on steam? That would Afro
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Trigardon
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« Reply #5 on: April 28, 2020, 01:50:07 am »

Quote
Chemical Weapons do more damage to buildings. Incin does more player damage too.
They do more than enough damage to buildings already. Incinerator needs some change, just damage is the wrong one.

Quote
Electric Buff takes 1 second to charge meaning this should prevent block/elecing.
Worth trying, looks good to me.

Quote
Relocator can’t be used whilst snared, price is also increased to 1K gold.
Gold raise seems legit to me. If snares can disable relos, it should be raised in money too.

Quote
Human Siege loses the ability to eject and bali now costs 5.5k gold which is the same as summ. Bali is also given a forward sprint to try and promote aggression.
Every siege whore is crying right now. The whole problem about siege camping are the maps people play these days. You can strip it off the ability to eject, still people would camp because of one-way maps. Fix that first before touching sieges. My 2 cents here.

Quote
Shielded outpost has an option to either shield itself, or surrounding buildings and not both. Similar to how a commander can choose what guardian is used for. Shielded outpost also needs a 1k health reduction.
It shouldn't shield itself in any way. Does shield tower shield itself? No it doesn't. Fix please Daemon.

Quote
Give Entropy buff use for 150. Gates rarely succeed and this gives commanders a choice.  A shield like buff that stops shots. Melee and items can still damage the unit.
Sounds OP as hell to me if there's one good saccer. Because that would also negate tower arrows, right? Tongue

Quote
Entropy weapons do more damage to buildings. Chaos bolt does more player damage too. Remove rupture’s splash damage effect because you can’t see shit.
Ruptures splash damage makes it such a viable weapon for teamfights. Humans just can't see shit while using their ranged weapon. Why would you remove that?

Quote
Ophelia’s 5 is pretty much unused. I suggest her making a gate like structure, can be different in colour to stop confusion, which acts as a one way gate back to her base. 5 second construction time, 2 minute cooldown, 100 health and her not being able to use it herself should keep it balanced.
I like the gateway idea. It could be something like (in case anybody ever played it) Medivh in HotS. Just make it unusuable for sieges and give it a timer before death. Could be one great gapcloser for the whole team.

Quote
Ophelia’s orb heals other units for a small amount on direct hit. Her 4 should also require mana use which gradually builds up after she spawns, like summ. This stops people from spawning for 1 second, debuffing then going back to a normal unit.
No opinion on this.

Quote
Snares are reduced to 2 and have a long cast time, however they now have the ability to block relocs.
No. Just raise their price to make it fair. A long cast time would people make using it less which is exactly we shouldn't aim that direction.

Quote
Frost bolts have reduced building damage.
I disagree. Scatter is just as viable to kill spires as frost bolts are to kill towers.

Quote
Summoners are given a small sprint to promote attacking gameplay.
Once again, the maps played these days are the problem.

Quote
Behemoths are unable to capture spawn flags. They also have a mana use which gradually builds up after spawn to behe spawning.
Just make them unable to capture anything. There's no reason in the first place why we kept this shit. It's the only siege who's able to capture it. (ejecting doesnt count, if you cant kill a nomad getting a flag you're just rusty or terribad)

Quote
Self buffs are 100 per use, Comm buffs are 75 per use.
Why not make it 50 for commanders to actually support good commanding once again?

Quote
Longer cast on immob/snare or the ability to allow team-mates to shoot the immob/snare off. They’re far too easy to land.
Shooting stuff off seems pretty interesting to me. But will probably work 90 % better for humans than for beasts. Better not touch immobs / snares.

Quote
Countdown on Demo and Sac. Easier to time, meaning less stalemates.
Why were the timers removed in the first place? Just bring it back. No reason not to.

Quote
Human weapons to stop affecting the beast's movement. Flux often grounds people.
It shouldn't. I know it does, but it just shouldn't. I think that some hardcoded problem related to taking damage anims? Not sure about this, Clemens any idea? Tongue

Quote
Ideally a New Building in order for you to get heroes. This means you have a way of disabling them as an opponent. (Like Sanctuary)
I support this so much you have no idea.

Quote
Allow commanders to see sensor range. (Circle around item, like shield)
Good idea. I like this. Would need some testing tho.

Quote
Allow commanders to disallow items/units. MMB hinders the team.
Oh please gawd, yess. Just do it. DO IT.

Quote
Get rid of corpses quicker. Behe bodies stay on the floor for way too long.
Make this optional maybe? Or just give us a command to clear ourselves.

Quote
Remove restrictions and spam from two players playing from same IP.
I think this is serversided. Not sure if you should force something onto players / serveradmins.

Quote
Allow commanders to get awards.
How about just stay commander and lead your team to victory? I disagree on this, supports commander spawning too much.

Quote
Increase in gold when siege hits buildings
Just no.

Quote
Gold is automatically given to the player on kill. Siege kills don’t award gold for kill and ranged kills are given 50% gold on kill.
This is a serversetting. I like the ranged kills 50 % gold idea.

Quote
Remove Guardian from giving +100 Entro to balance the new entro buff
100 + / - shouldn't affect the gameplay too much.

Quote
Remove Behemoth grounding human players.
This was made in the first place to stop people using behes knochback to exploit. Just don't change this. Maybe make it disappear once player hits the ground.

Quote
Siege nerfs to both sides prevent them from capturing a spawn point.
Remove humans invincibilty on ejecting.

Quote
Spawn protection is lost when a player melees/fires
Yes.

Quote
Add on steam
In case anyone is interested in helping I can tell you exactly what's needed to get it on Steam. Just don't get your hopes up high.

Quote
Steam achievements.
I was actually working on achievements years ago. I had a lot of ideas and if I get a hold of a developer who's up for the task I'd be more than happy to contribute my ideas. (oh yeah and I need a gfx artist for the pictures)

Quote
Add game to discord activity.
Shouldn't be too hard. Didn't Remi request that already?

Quote
More active social media
Afaik Tirza is the one being in hold of all that. And I'm not sure we're looking for another right now.

Quote
Display Discord, Facebook, Twitter and Reddit on Newerth.com.
I assigned the task to someone from the Newerth.com team already. (discord widget). Still waiting for it.
Rest is pretty useless without an active Social Media Manager / writer.

Quote
Fluorescent mushrooms with different neon colours for map prop.
Quote
The “boomshrooms” added as an april fools could be a  respawnable map prop that gives users a small amount of health(250) when hitting. Respawn time 5 seconds.
No opinion on this.

Quote
Animated background for Front page (with option to turn it off)
I like that. Didn't enlivens RMod had something like that?

Quote
Make a list of server changes and custom votes that have been made so returning players know what has changed. @drk
That'd be pretty awesome if you could do that.

Quote
Someone add twitch emotes
Please no. LUL Kappa

Quote
New icons for end game awards.
The ones we have right now are fine.

Quote
Add Map Editor button into main menu
That should be easy to do. But I think the main menu needs a general update.

Quote
A flag that can be captured over time by proximity. (Savage resurrection)
Did we sink so low, taking ideas from SavRez? Oh pity. No opinion on this.


PS: If you really want to nerf sieges just create an camp timer or something. Think off something better and maybe outside the box.
PPS: To fix siege respawn problem just create a "spawn timer" that works like a respawn timer. If siege is going back in, 10 seconds respawn time. No matter what unit is chosen for next spawn.

- Trig
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