Newerth Forums

Savage XR => General Savage XR Discussion => Topic started by: Hakugei on January 30, 2017, 05:10:10 am



Title: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on January 30, 2017, 05:10:10 am
Hello fellow Newerthians and Savages.

It has come to my attention that Savage XR, despite its age and external competition, is still alive.
Seriously, why? :-D
Even Savage Resurrection, from S2Games themselves, turned out to be nothing more than a fad.
A considerable amount of players, old and new, are still greatly invested in the infamous Battle for Newerth.
What better way to celebrate said undying spirit than with a long-overdue big patch?

It has certainly been quite a while since the stagnant gears of XR development were oiled into action, so what now?
While the Newerth Devs and Council have their own share of wishes and ideas upcoming for the patch behind closed doors, this time around I'd also like to take this patch's planning phase straight to the dedicated community itself.
Daemon has been paying attention over these last months, creating a long list of any requests he came across, but he can't always be around and the forum archives are too vast for me to shift through endlessly in my free time (you know, instead of actually make the patch).

So if you have a suggestion, wish, or even just an idea, please speak up and let your voice be heard.
Be it a fix, improvement, adjustment, addition, rebalance, removal, reconsideration, or anything else one might think of, feel free to share it with me.
You don't have a request of your own? No problem; dig up someone else's forgotten ideas or tell a friend to drop by instead.

Have no fear, just because someone requests something doesn't immediately mean every troll or bad idea is going to make it into the final revision before patch day (e.g. Kenway and Natsu, to name a few). I still very much reserve the right to reject requests I deem unsuitable (e.g. changing the melee system or gamebreaking rebalancing), but I hope to add as many wishes as feasible.
Trolls and troublemakers will be ignored; continued intentional disturbances will even be banned.
I will not permit said disturbances to distract from serious posts, requests, and discussions.

And for anyone concerned about my return, rest assured as it's just a temporary period to create and oversee XR 1.3. :-)

PS: Daemon is in the market for another wave of adding Custom Clan Items as well, so if you wish to have them uploaded in this patch, please start working on them and submit them as soon as possible.

There is no set nor known deadline, so you have as long as until 1.3 is done. :?
Alright, that is all! Back to the dark, damp, lonely coding dungeon I go.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: SOMA on January 30, 2017, 01:40:09 pm
awesome, this is one of best news in 2017  :smitten: 
i don't know if this can give you some ideas or not  :|
- if i can say, is it possible to make some changes in units human/beast? like some new color/style instead of existing one ?
- what about another style for level upgrade? ex: if units get level 10 maybe they can get special weapon or some other style O-o.
- can you make something for workers ? i think they're ignored enough :D
- what about making Items Store?

All the Best


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on January 30, 2017, 04:13:37 pm
- if i can say, is it possible to make some changes in units human/beast? like some new color/style instead of existing one ?
Yes, it's possible, but are you asking us to replace the current team colors for different ones?

- what about another style for level upgrade? ex: if units get level 10 maybe they can get special weapon or some other style O-o.
Yes, also possible. We can certainly fancify or diversify the level ups some more. But how would you players like it?

- can you make something for workers ? i think they're ignored enough :D
I might need a little more than "do something with workers, please".... :-D

- what about making Items Store?
Can you elaborate?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on January 30, 2017, 04:22:02 pm
- what about making Items Store?
Can you elaborate?

NO. You would need items, and except for weapons and shields, the rest range between hard and impossible to attach. And if it's all just cosmetic and free of charge, there's nobody available to make dozens of them worth a few thousand euros of time. And if it's for money, it will hurt our chances to get XR on steam.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: SOMA on January 30, 2017, 05:24:42 pm
- what about making Items Store?
Can you elaborate?

NO. You would need items, and except for weapons and shields, the rest range between hard and impossible to attach. And if it's all just cosmetic and free of charge, there's nobody available to make dozens of them worth a few thousand euros of time. And if it's for money, it will hurt our chances to get XR on steam.

if you make items store which is allow players to go and select a unique weapon or shield/helmet for human, and some other cool design for human/beasts ofc it will NOT be free of charge, u can make many design with different cost, you can allow ppl to communicate with a designers to request a special item with totally different cost if they want special design for them. maybe i want special behe tree weapon!! or maybe cool helmet for shaman "only for my account"..etc.
if it possible to have something like wallet that i can save all my items and switch whatever i like under my account.
by the time and if this succeeded, we can expect new offers from u with less quantity/period/price

if it passed we can expect a some cool option form you, (axe/sword) (Axe/Shield) (sword/shield) (Sword/Helmet/shield) etc... 
this can be provide as an option to whoever want to create a new clan.. and i can expect more cost for clan items as it will be applied for many players inside the clan as well as if they want special design
i hope you can agree with this  :cry:
 


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Nanaa on January 30, 2017, 06:11:29 pm
Soma, what if you forget your account's password and you bought items attached to that account. There is no automatic password retrieval system via email. And as we have seen, there is noone in the staff willing to go through the trouble retrieving passwords.

Also a valid point:
And if it's for money, it will hurt our chances to get XR on steam.

I think it's already cool if custom item clans such as XR1.0 are accessible to all players. http://www.newerth.com/?id=stats&action=view_clan&uid=84658&pp=search_clan&pk=xr

Maybe Daemon will make XR 1.3 custom item clan?  :roll:


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on January 30, 2017, 06:14:03 pm
Does all suggestions need to be dropped in here? It would be a mess in no-time... why not use the suggestion forum (The one daemon created quite some time back)?

In case youre gonna use that part of the section- a friendly advice is to link to it in the initial post hakugei


Aside from that, i look forward to spam you guys with my suggestions, and ignorant arguefor why whatever suggestion it is, is awesome and correct regardless of what other people think  :-P


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on January 30, 2017, 07:30:41 pm
Does all suggestions need to be dropped in here? It would be a mess in no-time... why not use the suggestion forum (The one daemon created quite some time back)?
I'll regularily be checking this thread and collecting the suggestions; it won't get too big of a mess.
I'll also accept PMs, Skype messages, and forwards from other Devs you prefer talking to instead of me.
It doesn't have to be here, but this keeps it all nicely together.
Do you mean the Re-balancing Suggestions (http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/board,126.0.html) section?
That's strictly for balance related suggestions. :) Bugfixes, improvements, and anything not strictly balance wouldn't fit there.
For balance suggestions feel free to post over there, too, though.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on January 30, 2017, 08:40:25 pm
Small and objectively good change:

Make t3 and t4 colors more extreme, so one could tell enemy from ally at a glance

Big and Controversial change:

Make Sacrifice research require Lair level 2. The most op tactic gets nerfed, games last longer, better game to warmup ratio, Savage survives for one more year.

e:

none game related change. Delete the vast majority of sub forums here. Having too many forums both makes the forum more dead and makes it look more dead than it is.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Ale on January 30, 2017, 09:30:15 pm
Make t3 and t4 colors more extreme, so one could tell enemy from ally at a glance

I believe there was a patch from some S2 developer giving the second human team a different skin color (black). I liked it.

Edit:
http://www.newerth.com/?id=downloads&op=displayDownload&category=10&file=savage5.s2z
There it is. It would solve the problem for humans.


Bug:
After relocating you get stuck in between weapons. You cant block/swing until you switched forth and back to another weapon/item.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on January 30, 2017, 10:23:03 pm
Make t3 and t4 colors more extreme, so one could tell enemy from ally at a glance

I believe there was a patch from some S2 developer giving the second human team a different skin color (black). I liked it.

Edit:
http://www.newerth.com/?id=downloads&op=displayDownload&category=10&file=savage5.s2z
There it is. It would solve the problem for humans.


Bug:
After relocating you get stuck in between weapons. You cant block/swing until you switched forth and back to another weapon/item.

You should be easily able to make this XR-compatible and add it.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on January 30, 2017, 10:25:12 pm
Needs normalmaps and glossmaps AT LEAST. Plus it needs beasts' skins too. It's a valid request tho. At the very least i can make T3/T4 skins brighter or using saturated green or some shit.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on January 30, 2017, 10:45:27 pm
- Anti camping solution
- Fix clan icon ingame on stats - it was FOX earlier now it's VtX icon.
- Fix the auth problem some guys are having
- Implement GUI element which shows resources carrying (gold and redstone - like in sav rez)
- Fix levelup tooltips to be more accurate
- Fix bugged shuffle vote crashing servers (or whatever vote it exactly was)
- Make connect to chat in the serverlist optional (or add an options whether you want to auto join or not)
- Implement 'Report a player' function - makes it easier for referees and server administrators
- Find an effective way for the mute / kick votes and referee commands.
- Disallow mutiple client
- Fix human_fluxgun (still drains stamina or doesn't let stamina recover) <- just too op for a level 2 weapon.

just few things.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on January 30, 2017, 10:50:21 pm
- Anti camping solution
- Fix clan icon ingame on stats - it was FOX earlier now it's VtX icon.
- Fix the auth problem some guys are having
- Implement GUI element which shows resources carrying (gold and redstone - like in sav rez)
- Fix levelup tooltips to be more accurate
- Fix bugged shuffle vote crashing servers (or whatever vote it exactly was)
- Make connect to chat in the serverlist optional (or add an options whether you want to auto join or not)
- Implement 'Report a player' function - makes it easier for referees and server administrators
- Find an effective way for the mute / kick votes and referee commands.
- Disallow mutiple client
- Fix human_fluxgun (still drains stamina or doesn't let stamina recover) <- just too op for a level 2 weapon.

just few things.

Some could be done, some can't, some are too vague, while gameplay changes should be discussed in Rebalancing Section. Game-changing ones aren't gonna fly with the admins' group ultimately voting for the changes, tho.

They're all too vague, actually :).


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on January 31, 2017, 02:06:29 am
Make t3 and t4 colors more extreme, so one could tell enemy from ally at a glance
Sounds feasible and worthwhile, Daemon will get right on that.

Make Sacrifice research require Lair level 2. The most op tactic gets nerfed, games last longer, better game to warmup ratio, Savage survives for one more year.
Such a big balance change is a tad bit out of my paygrade.
This would have to be posted in the rebalancing section and be discussed thoroughly.
(Implementing the change itself is quick and simple, though.)


After relocating you get stuck in between weapons. You cant block/swing until you switched forth and back to another weapon/item.
Always or under certain cases?
Consistently or seemingly random?


- Anti camping solution
Like what?

- Fix clan icon ingame on stats - it was FOX earlier now it's VtX icon.
- Fix the auth problem some guys are having
- Find an effective way for the mute / kick votes and referee commands.
- Disallow mutiple client
Could you elaborate please?

- Implement GUI element which shows resources carrying (gold and redstone - like in sav rez)
- Fix levelup tooltips to be more accurate
- Implement 'Report a player' function - makes it easier for referees and server administrators
Makes sense, I'll check it out.

- Fix bugged shuffle vote crashing servers (or whatever vote it exactly was)
I might need more information than "or whatever it was". :?

- Make connect to chat in the serverlist optional (or add an options whether you want to auto join or not)
Are you talking about the shoutbox-esque chat?

- Fix human_fluxgun (still drains stamina or doesn't let stamina recover) <- just too op for a level 2 weapon.
As I've stated many times before, fluxgun doesn't have a stamina drain.
In fact, no weapon has stamina drain.
And all weapons have stamina regen disable, not just flux. :-(
This may need a lot more backing to push through, as it's not just a minor thing.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on January 31, 2017, 08:42:42 am
Make t3 and t4 colors more extreme, so one could tell enemy from ally at a glance
Sounds feasible and worthwhile, Daemon will get right on that.

It's on the list.

- Fix clan icon ingame on stats - it was FOX earlier now it's VtX icon.
- Fix the auth problem some guys are having
- Find an effective way for the mute / kick votes and referee commands.
- Disallow mutiple client
Could you elaborate please?

-There's a specific, albeit quite random icon that clanless stats display all over the place: in the Stats page, in Shoutbox chat, in map feedback panel and some other places ingame. Looks like the game doesn't know there's people w/o tags so it just grabs the last one it found, something like that.

-Auth problem probably means that certain players cannot authenticate. For some, changing that 25 port to something else might be a solution.

-He prolly means that mute/kick is not persistent if players reconnect, getting new clientID.

-He is not sure what he means but after talking over skype, it's probably something along the lines of "disallow multiple clients of the same machine, install, account AND IP". Meaning that you should not be able to connect with more clients, to spy on the enemy, to influence votes etc.

- Implement GUI element which shows resources carrying (gold and redstone - like in sav rez)
- Fix levelup tooltips to be more accurate
- Implement 'Report a player' function - makes it easier for referees and server administrators
Makes sense, I'll check it out.

He probably means having some sort of a list that refs can open and see what other players have reported with something like /report player_name reason.

- Fix bugged shuffle vote crashing servers (or whatever vote it exactly was)
I might need more information than "or whatever it was". :?

Quote from: Groentjuh
If you're on a 3 or 4 team map and call a shuffle vote it might be get stuck when you have teams * n + (teams - 2) players, because it cannot figure out how many players each team should have or something like that
Something like 4 players on 3 teams is 2 players each and 1 team with 1 player :P
It results in a infinite loop of shuffling players... 100% cpu usage and killing of the proces will get the server back :(
I rather have it segfault and restart :D


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Ale on January 31, 2017, 08:52:19 am
After relocating you get stuck in between weapons. You cant block/swing until you switched forth and back to another weapon/item.
Always or under certain cases?
Consistently or seemingly random?


I think consistently but I will check on that. I believe the game thinks you are still holding the relocator in your hands which is gone by the time you used it. However it switches back to 3rd person view as if you were holding a melee weapon. Your unit looks weird and bugged until you switched to a different weapon/item. I guess most people don't notice this effect as they use relocating for getting back into their base entering a spawn location right after. However if you use relocator in a tactical manner, quickly moving from A to B in order to continue fighting from somewhere else (i.e. defending a spawn flag) this bug gets quite annoying.


Regarding the flux issue: Whatever the effect is that keeps beast units from regaining stamania when fluxed, it is one of the few things that can effectively counter a sac rush which remains the most vicious thing beasts can do. I vote for keeping flux at it is.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on January 31, 2017, 09:23:34 am
^ I also frequently run into the bug Ale speaks of. Don't remember what exactly causes it, might be trying to switch to medpacks too quickly after relocating.



Concerning bugs, fixing the one linked below would open a lot of cool possibilities for map making. Such as a hill with boulders rolling down, when they hit a pit at the end of it, they'll teleport back up and roll down again. It almost works with the current physics engine, there's just a small and I assume easy to fix bug that prevents this. Detailed explanation and demo in the map I made for showcasing the bug a long while ago:

http://www.newerth.com/?id=maps&mid=2599

I'm probably too lazy to touch the map editor again, but maybe Klikk or someone could make something cool with this.

Might as well list all the other bugs I'm aware of.

An annoying and probably easy to fix map editor bug:

Quote
All "refset team 2" turn into "refset team 1" in the object file. I'm not exactly sure at what point this change happens, but I suspect it's when you load a map in the editor. If you place a team 2 building (can be anything, arcana for example) and save the map, it stays a team 2 building. But when you edit the map again later, it's ownership has turned to team 1.

For anyone struggling with this bug, it's much quicker to find those "refset team 1" in the objpos file and fix them with a text editor than it is to replace those buildings in the map editor.

The bug that turned xr_bubbles into complete non-functional ass:

Original version of the map on devworld had perfect dynamic sound effects. You'd get splashes when you jump in or out the water. An oxygen sound when you find a underwater bubble. A huge splash sound when you use underwater jumppad. It provided actual underwater gameplay that felt decent. Sound effects worked fine on devworld, but on Groen's Kingdom they didn't. The effects simply didn't spawn. My memory of the specifics of this bug are very vague since it was a long time ago I struggled with this.

Quote
There's something like:

!exec target client "spawneffect _oxygensound_ #gs_object_posx# #gs_object_posy# #gs_object_posz#"

that works on devworld but does not work on Groentjuh's Kingdom server

 (Don't use currently uploaded xr_bubbles for testing this bug, the current version has one of the many hacky non-functional workarounds I tested to try to get them to work properly)

If that one gets fixed, map-makers could play custom sound effects in situations that calls for them. This would make all kinds of different gameplay features possible, not just underwater effects.



Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on January 31, 2017, 09:52:10 am
Any one more thing. I don't know how much effort this would require, if not much then it might be worth doing:

Different color/texture variations dynamic objects. I'm specifically thinking about the boulders, which only come in a mossy texture. If I wanted to make a western-style map with boulders rolling around, that would look very out of place. A boulder with the canyon texture would look great tho. And Monkits with white fur for winter maps. Stuff like that. Probably not worth doing if it requires more than a small time investment, but would be nice.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on January 31, 2017, 10:03:48 am
- Fix human_fluxgun (still drains stamina or doesn't let stamina recover) <- just too op for a level 2 weapon.
As I've stated many times before, fluxgun doesn't have a stamina drain.
In fact, no weapon has stamina drain.
And all weapons have stamina regen disable, not just flux. :-(
This may need a lot more backing to push through, as it's not just a minor thing.

Flux is the only dangerous weapon as it's the only human weapon who has an continuous stream which makes it rather OP.
And you're wrong. I was checking human_fluxgun.object and it says:
"objSet staminaDrain 0.000000"
same goes for repeater. Now you tell me all weapons have stamina regen disable which is simply wrong in my eyes. And this is exactly why it's a bug :smitten:

EDIT: was checking server files, the .object files are 1:1 - it is NOT the staminadrain but something else that is buggy.

Regarding the flux issue: Whatever the effect is that keeps beast units from regaining stamania when fluxed, it is one of the few things that can effectively counter a sac rush which remains the most vicious thing beasts can do. I vote for keeping flux at it is.

I tested this on G&G, GK and Pulse. The flux bug only seem to occur on Pulse and now you tell me it's the only thing that stops a sac rush? You're wrong. It's the high damage and the continuous stream which does the work, not the bugs that come with it.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Ulquiorra on January 31, 2017, 10:06:52 am
Just a couple of thoughts, feel free to say nope!
 * Merge forum and game authentication (it looks like auth comes to newerth anywhos, so one db which would allow account recovery would be sweet)
 * TLS on the forum / login ;)!
 * There is a bug which has been around since the dawn of time where occasionally the spawn gui will freeze, and you cant see your load out, usually happens after requesting gold, so you change your load out but your screen stays with what you had before

For the flux, from memory wasn't it its not draining manner but when hit it makes you twitch, and as its hitting very very quickly it slows you down as its playing the 'ow' animation over and over (though its been many many years :D)
---------

Totally random q's, whats savage and the server written in? I can see its got python extensions,


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on January 31, 2017, 10:12:33 am
Totally random q's, whats savage and the server written in? I can see its got python extensions,

Savage Source Code (2.00e) (http://www.newerth.com/?id=downloads&op=displayDownload&category=6&file=savage1-source.zip)

Python was implemented by Mohican years ago. Manual can be found inside your /game/python/ directory.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Ale on January 31, 2017, 10:18:19 am
Regarding the flux issue: Whatever the effect is that keeps beast units from regaining stamania when fluxed, it is one of the few things that can effectively counter a sac rush which remains the most vicious thing beasts can do. I vote for keeping flux at it is.

I tested this on G&G, GK and Pulse. The flux bug only seem to occur on Pulse and now you tell me it's the only thing that stops a sac rush? You're wrong. It's the high damage and the continuous stream which does the work, not the bugs that come with it.

What? I can remember stamania issues when getting fluxed since... ever. Also if it's a server issue this would be the wrong place to report it.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on January 31, 2017, 10:28:41 am
Regarding the flux issue: Whatever the effect is that keeps beast units from regaining stamania when fluxed, it is one of the few things that can effectively counter a sac rush which remains the most vicious thing beasts can do. I vote for keeping flux at it is.

I tested this on G&G, GK and Pulse. The flux bug only seem to occur on Pulse and now you tell me it's the only thing that stops a sac rush? You're wrong. It's the high damage and the continuous stream which does the work, not the bugs that come with it.

What? I can remember stamania issues when getting fluxed since... ever. Also if it's a server issue this would be the wrong place to report it.

It is not. Because basically it should be applied to both client and server installs.

Feel free to try it on Groentjuhs and on Pulse. (take a buddy with you) and tell me about your results. Feel free to prove me wrong on this!  :-)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Ulquiorra on January 31, 2017, 10:47:32 am
Totally random q's, whats savage and the server written in? I can see its got python extensions,

Savage Source Code (2.00e) (http://www.newerth.com/?id=downloads&op=displayDownload&category=6&file=savage1-source.zip)

Python was implemented by Mohican years ago. Manual can be found inside your /game/python/ directory.

Ah sorry I mean the game client and the server, dont think they are open source are they :)?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on January 31, 2017, 10:50:31 am
Totally random q's, whats savage and the server written in? I can see its got python extensions,

Savage Source Code (2.00e) (http://www.newerth.com/?id=downloads&op=displayDownload&category=6&file=savage1-source.zip)

Python was implemented by Mohican years ago. Manual can be found inside your /game/python/ directory.

Ah sorry I mean the game client and the server, dont think they are open source are they :)?

XR is not open source, no.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Ulquiorra on January 31, 2017, 01:41:36 pm
Totally random q's, whats savage and the server written in? I can see its got python extensions,

Savage Source Code (2.00e) (http://www.newerth.com/?id=downloads&op=displayDownload&category=6&file=savage1-source.zip)

Python was implemented by Mohican years ago. Manual can be found inside your /game/python/ directory.

Ah sorry I mean the game client and the server, dont think they are open source are they :)?

XR is not open source, no.

No matter then :-)! Was wondering if the back end had been migrated to python or something or if it just calls :), I can be a pair of eyes if you would like over anything though my C++ and C is pretty rusty heh

Its awsome Savage is still going after all these years, I can remember many many hours playing things like eden and choke i think it was, (and many more camping on initial with the master bow!)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Necrophiliac on January 31, 2017, 02:07:53 pm
Although SavRez's life time was short, I felt during the month that it was alive a few good changes were made. They were always working on balance and they introduced this teleport system for beast/human to use which was a prolonged reloc. I thought it was a nice feature, however I dont think such a change would be made in this game. They also turned of self buffs so they were obviously doing something right.
Anyway, here's my list. I suggest getting any help that his available :) Tirza/PirateHat could help with the steam release and Tjens always seems willing to help. I'm useless at everything so i'm not use to anyone.


Balance
-Make incinerator and chaos bolt more useful.
-Reduce ammo of flux.
-Change the positions of sac and fireward in tech slot to slow down sacs
-Reduce Health of groot tree
-Would still like to see something done about buffs, whether it be reducing the power of t1 buffs or slow down the buff refill. -Guess it's too late at this point, i'll just stick to t1 :) Definitely deters the noobs.


New stuff
-Add to steam, which leads me onto removing all copyrighted material from the game.
- Finish and implement the stat icons (http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,17001.0.html) that eXZeth has been working on. This should remove copyrighted image that are there.
-Customisation for units(Although Daemon has already said no to this, still think it would be good idea for community mods)
-Donation button
-Maybe change the outdated title and server browser background with something new. Always like the animated ones, however you there should be an option to revert back the the old one.
-Maybe the map editor into savage, or give it a button to start the program
-There was a few new voice commands (http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,18515.msg201203.html#msg201203) that SOMA found in the files. Would like to see them implemented somewhere, especially "I'm in position"
- Any new props for map editor is always a big plus.


Big Fixes
-There's an annoying bug that occurs on 4 team maps. When a team is about to lose they will call a concede vote, if that teams dies before the concede has had time to finish it will carry over to the next team causing them to lose. This is if the vote was going to pass.
-Would like to see 32x32 maps fixed.
-Fix collision boxes on most props, a player being able to hide in rocks just seems broken.
-Behe swing animation not showing.
-When on the team selection page, a bug happens where the play button seems to stop working, so you need to click menu for the game to actually play.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Marbello on January 31, 2017, 02:33:31 pm
With regards to votes, the following suggestions:
/callvote lastmap for stonerflashbacks
and the obvious /callvote happy birthday  (that bans djinghis and cumway for 24hours)

Other than that, further RPG elements would maybe keep newcomers around for longer.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on January 31, 2017, 02:42:50 pm

Balance
-Make incinerator and chaos bolt more useful.
-Reduce ammo of flux.
-Change the positions of sac and fireward in tech slot to slow down sacs
-Reduce Health of groot tree
-Would still like to see something done about buffs, whether it be reducing the power of t1 buffs or slow down the buff refill. -Guess it's too late at this point, i'll just stick to t1 :) Definitely deters the noobs.

Ignored. Make a proper case where these things can be discussed, not lazy, half-baked one liners! Link in front page post.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Necrophiliac on January 31, 2017, 02:48:12 pm
Can't be fucked to post it 3 different areas. Ignore balance changes then, they'll most likely be ignored even in the new area.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on January 31, 2017, 02:59:22 pm
With regards to votes, the following suggestions:
/callvote lastmap for stonerflashbacks
and the obvious /callvote happy birthday  (that bans djinghis and cumway for 24hours)

Other than that, further RPG elements would maybe keep newcomers around for longer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JiSS5xn_0fc

Alright same map - Here we go!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on January 31, 2017, 02:59:56 pm

Ignored. Make a proper case where these things can be discussed, not lazy, half-baked one liners! Link in front page post.

Let's be honest here. If he does waste his time in writing several paragraphs of obvious, it'll still be ignored, just like my monologue (http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,17534.msg196936.html#msg196936) on healers was. The obvious effects of slowing down a sac rush are obvious, the unobvious ones will only come out during playtesting. Probably nerfing sac rush would slightly buff chem rush, which would be an added bonus. The balance of a few specific maps would change in unpredictable ways, but that's unavoidable with any large change. e

I'd still do it my way though and make it require level 2 instead of switching the items. With countless games played where level 2 was gotten before sac, I'd say sac rush would still be strong enough. And this way we don't have to worry about the effects of earlier than before firewards.


This change has huge upsides I already mentioned in my earlier post. If it does have downsides, no one will know them before they come up in regular play. The beneficial effects of the change are obvious enough that it should be tested.

edit:

I re-read that monologue I linked to. The player base moving from Kingdom (where shimmying is possible) to Pulse (where it's not) gave chaps one role. They can heal otherwise unreachable shields. On Kingdom those shields were usually reachable with shimmying so that wasn't needed. It's still sad Chaps are a very bad option for anything else, but at least the unit serves some purpose now.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on January 31, 2017, 03:32:50 pm
This thread is for obvious improvement, bugs, glitches that only need reporting. Balance changes need discussions of their own, not 200 pages or random garbage.

There haven't been any patches in like 2 years but now there will be, and we're gonna pick up where we left off with balance changes too.

And for the last damn time, balance changes ard discussed, tweaked and voted by a comitee of people in Newerth Council, like myself, Gridfon, DJ, Darkbread, Groentjuh, Tirza, Shagroth, Stringer, Valli etc. THEY NEED TO HAVE ALL THE TALKS AND ALL THE DATA ABOUT A GIVEN SUBJECT IN A CLEAN, READABLE FORM.

Everyone has a mind of their own. If you want your resons to be reviewed, understood and adopted, post where and how it matters. Otherwise, just complain.

P.S. New stuff it's all mine, no council, thank god :).


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Urien on January 31, 2017, 03:56:30 pm
On savage resurrection, there was the feature where what ever the commander clicks on a location or building, all units that was selected by the commander would see a green path showing where they needed to go.

Is there something like that in XR? I found it really useful in Rez.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on January 31, 2017, 04:02:27 pm
On savage resurrection, there was the feature where what ever the commander clicks on a location or building, all units that was selected by the commander would see a green path showing where they needed to go.

Is there something like that in XR? I found it really useful in Rez.

There is building and unit marking for both comm and officers, which is visible from anywhere but shows no green path but green arrows :).


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on January 31, 2017, 04:20:18 pm
Having a green line showing from where to where they're going would be one nice feature tho!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on January 31, 2017, 04:28:37 pm
Having a green line showing from where to where they're going would be one nice feature tho!
What if it goes through enemy base?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on January 31, 2017, 05:14:15 pm
-There's a specific, albeit quite random icon that clanless stats display all over the place: in the Stats page, in Shoutbox chat, in map feedback panel and some other places ingame. Looks like the game doesn't know there's people w/o tags so it just grabs the last one it found, something like that.
I vaguely remember this happening before already; didn't I fix that? :-D
What happened? Does anyone know when this started (again)? :?

-Auth problem probably means that certain players cannot authenticate. For some, changing that 25 port to something else might be a solution.
If that's what he means, DJ/Groent needs contacting, and in return they may need to tell me what (if) they need changed from my side.

-He prolly means that mute/kick is not persistent if players reconnect, getting new clientID.
Reconnected players don't receive a new clientid, and mutes/kicks are stored (since a long time already).
A way around it is, obviously, reconnecting with a different IP or account.
So is that meant then?

-[...]something along the lines of "disallow multiple clients of the same machine, install, account AND IP". Meaning that you should not be able to connect with more clients, to spy on the enemy, to influence votes etc.
I vaguely remember coding something for that concerning multiple voters.
I might take a look in general, but I'm uncertain if restricting it completely is worth the cost.

He probably means having some sort of a list that refs can open and see what other players have reported with something like /report player_name reason.
Is /report an actual thing? Because it's certainly not an XR addition, which would imply it's handled via python server scripts made by server admins themselves. And that, in return, means I can't improve upon that feature.
So please tell me more. :) And if server admins want it shipped as an official XR patch, inform me about it.
Unless you're just saying it would be nice IF such a thing existed, in which case I may consider it.

Quote from: Groentjuh
If you're on a 3 or 4 team map and call a shuffle vote it might be get stuck when you have teams * n + (teams - 2) players, because it cannot figure out how many players each team should have or something like that
Something like 4 players on 3 teams is 2 players each and 1 team with 1 player :P
It results in a infinite loop of shuffling players... 100% cpu usage and killing of the proces will get the server back :(
I rather have it segfault and restart :D
Got it, I'll take a look.


I think consistently but I will check on that.
The more concrete information I receive, the more likely I can reproduce it, test it, track it down, and ultimately fix it.
It sounds like an annoying bug.


Concerning bugs, fixing the one linked below would open a lot of cool possibilities for map making.
http://www.newerth.com/?id=maps&mid=2599
I can't promise much, as dynamic objects was Mohican's baby.
I'll keep it in mind in case I run out of other tasks to complete.

All "refset team 2" turn into "refset team 1" in the object file. I'm not exactly sure at what point this change happens, but I suspect it's when you load a map in the editor. If you place a team 2 building (can be anything, arcana for example) and save the map, it stays a team 2 building. But when you edit the map again later, it's ownership has turned to team 1.
That is certainly annoying, but the Editor is old and outdated in general.
I've barely ever touched it, so we'll see what can be done.

Original version of the map on devworld had perfect dynamic sound effects.
!exec target client "spawneffect _oxygensound_ #gs_object_posx# #gs_object_posy# #gs_object_posz#"

that works on devworld but does not work on Groentjuh's Kingdom server

If that one gets fixed, map-makers could play custom sound effects in situations that calls for them. This would make all kinds of different gameplay features possible, not just underwater effects.
That's because the "spawneffect" command is client-side only; effects are entirely client-side and servers neither have the commands nor even run any effects. It's not the server's fault and is completely unrelated to Groentjuh's Kingdom - this will be the same on every server.
Sounds like a worthwhile request, but do be aware that it's not a small task since this isn't a bug in the first place - it's an entirely new feature.

Different color/texture variations dynamic objects. I'm specifically thinking about the boulders, which only come in a mossy texture.
Are you up for it, Daemon? :-D


And you're wrong. I was checking human_fluxgun.object and it says:
"objSet staminaDrain 0.000000"
Trig, that objSet manages the RABID effect. :mrgreen: S2Games' atrocious naming sense has fooled you.
Either they wanted it to be a drain and never finished it, or they could have benefitted from a dictionary or two.
You'll notice a lot of inconsistencies in S2's naming sense, like beast_immolate (for Sacrifice), beast_medic (for Shaman), beast_fire_trap (for Fire Ward), beast_protect (for Storm Shield), beast_vampire (for Carnivorous) JUST to name a few.
This includes properties and cvars as well, if you were to go looking for them.
I haven't renamed it to something more appropriate because it would be a huge hassle to make sure every .object file is adjusted accordingly (if I forget something, it breaks) and then also ensure that certain names are not hardcoded as well.
Also, it's called staminaDrain in states as well, but has the same NOT draining effect.
...oh and, you know, the fact that it's set to 0.0 means that it's not active. :roll:

same goes for repeater. Now you tell me all weapons have stamina regen disable which is simply wrong in my eyes. And this is exactly why it's a bug

EDIT: was checking server files, the .object files are 1:1 - it is NOT the staminadrain but something else that is buggy.
I actually mentioned this multiple times in the past, as this is a recurring mistake flux-haters make. :-D
But the truth is, it's not a bug as it was coded intentionally.
Flux just is really annoying to fight against, so people keep finding new reasons to complain about it.
It's not a bugfix, it's a major rebalancing request. :wink:
Remove stamina interrupt from all weapons (or even attacks) is the first step.


* Merge forum and game authentication (it looks like auth comes to newerth anywhos, so one db which would allow account recovery would be sweet)
 * TLS on the forum / login ;)!
That would be lovely! But totally out of my area of expertise. I'll add it to the list, maybe I'll feeling masochistic. :-D

* There is a bug which has been around since the dawn of time where occasionally the spawn gui will freeze, and you cant see your load out, usually happens after requesting gold, so you change your load out but your screen stays with what you had before
This doesn't ring a bell, and I have been around since the dawn of time. :p
I'll try to reproduce it, but any additional information would be helpful.


they introduced this teleport system for beast/human to use which was a prolonged reloc. I thought it was a nice feature, however I dont think such a change would be made in this game.
I'm certain something of similar calibre could be added, but this may require a Rebalance discussion (and that tends to require a thread there, first) for the Newerth Council. I'm not for nor against this, currently.

Balance
-Make incinerator and chaos bolt more useful.
-Reduce ammo of flux.
-Change the positions of sac and fireward in tech slot to slow down sacs
-Reduce Health of groot tree
-Would still like to see something done about buffs, whether it be reducing the power of t1 buffs or slow down the buff refill.
As Daemon said, these things are beyond my scope to decide, so they will require Rebalancing posts.
And as he also said, it was stagnant for a long time because there weren't going to be any patches.
Now is exactly the time to get those discussed, considered, and even patched in.

New stuff
-Add to steam, which leads me onto removing all copyrighted material from the game.
- Finish and implement the stat icons (http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,17001.0.html) that eXZeth has been working on. This should remove copyrighted image that are there.
Yes, Steam would be nice.
-Customisation for units(Although Daemon has already said no to this, still think it would be good idea for community mods)
Daemon didn't say no to community mods, he said that implementing a Custom Items Shop is not feasible due to certain issues.

-Donation button
There used to be one, until it had to be taken down due to uh...let's call it "politics".

-Maybe change the outdated title and server browser background with something new. Always like the animated ones, however you there should be an option to revert back the the old one.
Like into what?

-Maybe the map editor into savage, or give it a button to start the program
Sure.

-There was a few new voice commands (http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,18515.msg201203.html#msg201203) that SOMA found in the files. Would like to see them implemented somewhere, especially "I'm in position"
I'll leave that up to Daemon's discretion, and stick around for assistance if need be.

- Any new props for map editor is always a big plus.
I agree, but someone has to actually make them first. :-(

Big Fixes
-There's an annoying bug that occurs on 4 team maps. When a team is about to lose they will call a concede vote, if that teams dies before the concede has had time to finish it will carry over to the next team causing them to lose. This is if the vote was going to pass.
Haha, that's funny. Seems like the 3/4 team feature has plenty of issues in general.

-Would like to see 32x32 maps fixed.
What's actually broken?

-Fix collision boxes on most props, a player being able to hide in rocks just seems broken.
I thought Daemon already fixed many/all props, which ones aren't?

-Behe swing animation not showing.
I can take another look, but it seemed too random to test.

-When on the team selection page, a bug happens where the play button seems to stop working, so you need to click menu for the game to actually play.
When and how does this happen?


With regards to votes, the following suggestions:
/callvote lastmap for stonerflashbacks
What? :) For the ones too lazy to type /callvote restartmatch or call the same map again?

Other than that, further RPG elements would maybe keep newcomers around for longer.
Like what?




Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on January 31, 2017, 05:23:21 pm
Requesting Stat fix;

Jumps are not registered in stats - they should be.





Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Shagroth on January 31, 2017, 06:50:50 pm
Make it (hopefully) Steam ready!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on January 31, 2017, 07:36:55 pm
1. My old  wish: rebuild demo rec-view system. Make a possibility for camera scripting. This would be aswesome for make good movies for promoting the game. But since I don't know the code I guess that it could be too hard to do it.
2. More possibilities for refs to control/monitor the game. For example to mute/kick with an additional params (like 'time untill', 'reason'). Bindings to guid, etc.
3. Some kind of the custom votes (something more than msg/world). It could be done with the help of the python and msg parsing but that's not it.
4. I want more gs_transmits  :-)
5. Also I'd suggest some kind of 'elo' ranking and future shufflings that will be depending from elos.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Ale on January 31, 2017, 08:34:02 pm
Reproduce reloc bug:

Join humans, buy a relocator, place the relocator, relocate and hold the right mouse button (you can also press it again right after relocating and hold it)

I just tested it for all units. Your unit will now be frozen in its moving animation though its equipment (melee weapon, squad flags, etc) is still moving as you walk around. Releasing the right mouse button solves the problem. You do not have to switch to another weapon/item to be able to fight again.


Another bug which annoys me personally:

As I recently have to get along with a really bad internet connection, the only thing i can do most of the time is commanding. When I command with a bad ping and try to place a building, it often gets rejected. I have to place the same building several times until it is actually appears on the map. If you could do anything about that I'd be quite grateful.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Ulquiorra on January 31, 2017, 10:06:59 pm



* Merge forum and game authentication (it looks like auth comes to newerth anywhos, so one db which would allow account recovery would be sweet)
 * TLS on the forum / login ;)!
That would be lovely! But totally out of my area of expertise. I'll add it to the list, maybe I'll feeling masochistic. :-D

Which one :), For the first it looks liek the python class doesnt have TLS support, https://docs.python.org/2.7/library/basehttpserver.html, boo, could replace the server with apache / nginx and have a CGI script,

For the second, does your python act as the auth server or just as a man in the middle which talks to S2's auth sever? Im not familar with the back end :), if its talking to yours, it would be easy! Just would need to query the site's DB, compute the hash and compare :D (I do python nowadays so am willing to help out with anything i can ^,^)

Quote

* There is a bug which has been around since the dawn of time where occasionally the spawn gui will freeze, and you cant see your load out, usually happens after requesting gold, so you change your load out but your screen stays with what you had before
This doesn't ring a bell, and I have been around since the dawn of time. :p
I'll try to reproduce it, but any additional information would be helpful.



Ill see if i can trigger :)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 01, 2017, 01:42:01 am
Requesting Stat fix;
Jumps are not registered in stats - they should be.
What's actually "broken" and thus in need of a fix?


1. My old  wish: rebuild demo rec-view system. Make a possibility for camera scripting. This would be aswesome for make good movies for promoting the game. But since I don't know the code I guess that it could be too hard to do it.
Sounds worthwhile, but that might take a while, so stay tuned until I get a chance to look at it.

2. More possibilities for refs to control/monitor the game. For example to mute/kick with an additional params (like 'time untill', 'reason'). Bindings to guid, etc.
Give me a full list of ideas and everyone else, especially server admins, are allowed to pitch in, too!

3. Some kind of the custom votes (something more than msg/world). It could be done with the help of the python and msg parsing but that's not it.
Like what? :-)

4. I want more gs_transmits  :-)
There are not enough...? :)

5. Also I'd suggest some kind of 'elo' ranking and future shufflings that will be depending from elos.
Isn't ELO (or any other rating system) kind of pointless without a matchmaking system and enough players to actually be categorized accordingly? ;)


[...]
Join humans, buy a relocator, place the relocator, relocate and hold the right mouse button (you can also press it again right after relocating and hold it)
[...]
Thank you, I'll have a look.

As I recently have to get along with a really bad internet connection, the only thing i can do most of the time is commanding. When I command with a bad ping and try to place a building, it often gets rejected. I have to place the same building several times until it is actually appears on the map. If you could do anything about that I'd be quite grateful.
I don't know if there's much I can do about that; I believe this has been the case for a long time now.
I'll add it to the bottom of the list to look at nearing the end, at least.


For the second, does your python act as the auth server or just as a man in the middle which talks to S2's auth sever?
S2 has abandoned Savage a long time ago, bit by bit reducing their support.
Newerth has been picking up the pieces equally, bit by bit.
Most everything, if not all, (you'd have to ask DJ and Groent for more info) is managed and hosted by Newerth itself.
There are certain improvements that can be made, but access is quite limited (for safety reasons).


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Urien on February 01, 2017, 03:55:58 am
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=quM0FBS5sw8

Here's some example of savage rez commander gameplay from beast faction.

Here, you can see that green pathways are created for the individual units to follow.

It'd be really awesome for XR to emulate this mechanic, because it helps players to fully understand and get a gist of where the commander wants them to go.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Ulquiorra on February 01, 2017, 12:21:13 pm


For the second, does your python act as the auth server or just as a man in the middle which talks to S2's auth sever?
S2 has abandoned Savage a long time ago, bit by bit reducing their support.
Newerth has been picking up the pieces equally, bit by bit.
Most everything, if not all, (you'd have to ask DJ and Groent for more info) is managed and hosted by Newerth itself.
There are certain improvements that can be made, but access is quite limited (for safety reasons).

Yaha :), well the merging accounts should be pretty easy then ^,^ (and relatively safe), you could do something like 'legacy' login, and should this fail, try the 'new' login method, so its a transparent change for the most part in the game, still would be calling the same XML thing on your port 1025 handler,

Then for all new regs ask for a email + username and pass, then an account on new earth can be inserted into the DB :), Im gonna take a stab and guess all the passwords are either in plain text so it wouldn't be to hard to migrate in theory, if not, probs need to have a old password column in the DB

Or better, use SteamsSSO implementation ;) (though this would be a bit more complicated)

(This of course if if your interesting in something like this, if you are wooo, if not aww :(,  )

Would you be interested in a hand working on the game :)? (As a disclaimer, im not a game dev, im a generic dev nowadays), it would be nice to learn / work on something used by others outside of my day to day work (though get if its nope your a random guy thats re-appeared after 6 years ;) )


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Groentjuh on February 01, 2017, 03:25:37 pm
The annoying thing is that there are 2 authentication systems:
1. that newer XML python thing on port 1025.
2. a MUCH older one in C! (SEP and up!)

The clients use the newer XML python on port 1025, while the server still verifies client information using the C version! (Clemens, can you look at that?!) Therefore changes are hard to do until all checks use the same system.

Of course when doing changes, it is important to consider what to do with all the existing data!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Ulquiorra on February 01, 2017, 03:43:01 pm
OOh back end insight:D!

Christ its in C no wonder >,< that would be a pain to implement hashing and salts, maybe expand the XML classes so its a try at the end? (I like a challenge)

As for existing data, you could have a tempory table which acts as a relation between the Newerth forums and game auth, the problem would be making sure that i dont say 'Hey guys im shagroth give me control of evo',

Maybe a 'proof' system, so for existing members generate a 'proof' file within the game to add to your sig that the game client can verify you are who you say you are

(This isnt just so i can recover my master bow camp account, honest)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 01, 2017, 07:53:25 pm
The clients use the newer XML python on port 1025, while the server still verifies client information using the C version! (Clemens, can you look at that?!) Therefore changes are hard to do until all checks use the same system.
I'm going to assume that you and valli didn't make any progress then.
Sounds like this task is being dumped onto me as well. :p
Alright, I'll add it to the list for now and get back to you when it's time.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 01, 2017, 09:54:32 pm
If you swap too often between public and duel servers you get at some point either GUI bugs or savage crashes completely. I don't know how to exactly debug this tho.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: SavageBeard on February 02, 2017, 04:08:38 am
I want to suggest what a prop/gameplay element I posted way back

http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,16379.msg181125.html#msg181125 (http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,16379.msg181125.html#msg181125)

A rebuildable sub/garr, sort of a flag that won't change hands so easily.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on February 02, 2017, 01:59:53 pm
Dynamic ladders are cool in theory, and could make for interesting maps and gameplay. But the current implementation doesn't work, since the ladder needs to be in a very specific angle to be walked, and getting the ladder to that angle is near impossible, and it won't stay at that angle when walked.

Perhaps this problem could be solved with a new type of prop, the siege ladder:

(http://i.imgur.com/kKMKWAf.png?1)

I don't know the physics system enough to guess at whether or not that would work properly. Siege stairs without ladder might be an easier way to achieve the same effect.


edit:

Another use for dynamic props, a combat shield to help team move through open areas with lots of weapons fire. Simply a box with altered proportions (tall enough to cover a pred, a bit wider so team mates behind the pred are covered, leaves only a small gap between the box and the ground) would work. I assume physics objects all have a "default position" to which they revert when being carried, so the current system should be able to handle this, only a prop with the right dimensions is needed.



(http://i.imgur.com/FnJcIKN.png)


I feel like the physics system has so much potential, but the current props don't really allow the objects to have much gameplay effect due to how difficult they are to use in gameplay situations. Perhaps props like the ones above would help map makers make better use of the system.


*****************************


In case more usable physics objects are added, here's a much needed tweak to go with them: disallow them from damaging buildings. The physics damage to buildings is so minor that it doesn't have real gameplay effect, but with enough time it does allow trolls (who teammates can't kill) to kill their own buildings with them. This limits what can be done with physics objects, can't really place them near bases or places that will likely have outposts.


*******
e: A crazy idea popped to my mind. This one probably wouldn't even work, but a man can dream..

Spoiler (Mouse-Over to read)
(http://i.imgur.com/GLe7KHB.png)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on February 02, 2017, 02:21:28 pm
1. My old  wish: rebuild demo rec-view system. Make a possibility for camera scripting. This would be aswesome for make good movies for promoting the game. But since I don't know the code I guess that it could be too hard to do it.
Sounds worthwhile, but that might take a while, so stay tuned until I get a chance to look at it.
I think that It can take too much time. Put it in the end of your list.
ps: I would spend time for bugfixing first of all but as you decide...

2. More possibilities for refs to control/monitor the game. For example to mute/kick with an additional params (like 'time untill', 'reason'). Bindings to guid, etc.
Give me a full list of ideas and everyone else, especially server admins, are allowed to pitch in, too!
My own ideas about this:
- servers need their internal dbs where they will store info about ref actions and python needs an api to communicate with such db
- /ref kick <name/#id> - kicks untill the end of the current round; db log (for ex.: kick_table)
- /ref python ban <name/#id/?uid> <ban_time/mins> <reason>; db log (..: ban_table)
- ban uid should work even if player is offline
- undo actions: /ref unban <guid> <reason>; db log: undo_actions_table
- undo actions: /ref unkick <guid> <reason>; db log: undo_actions_table
- /ref info <name|#id> -> server.notify ref about the player: uid, ip (maybe something more); But ip-info must be available at least for refs (because: nicklamers-spammers-reconnecters, two-clients, etc)
- to add into /ref info or to make another separate command like /ref ban-info <uid> -> answere: uid:time_untill/time_left:reason:ref_who_made_it
- something else...
(I could try to help if it's interesting for you: I am doing such system for myself now but only for stats: client request -> message -> server <--> http api <--> db (H2). All is inside 1 jar. No need no install anything except JRE. DB is in the one file that could be moved anywhere. Theoretically all this could be done inside a python. But I don't enjoy that way.)


3. Some kind of the custom votes (something more than msg/world). It could be done with the help of the python and msg parsing but that's not it.
Like what? :-)
For example (two steps):
1. An option to add a list of custom commands like:
sv_custom_votes_list = {'k1':v1, 'k2':v2}, where key='new_vote', value=str|number
or if such format is a pain in the ass for C to do it without v:
sv_custom_votes_list = ['key', 'key', 'key']
2. in sv_event.py admin will be able to handle these k/v or just keys:
def callvote(guid, vote_type, vote_info):
    if vote_type and vote_info....

Anyway this is just a 'wish'.

4. I want more gs_transmits  :-)
There are not enough...? :)
Any other kind of a tool for a server admin to make remote changes on the client side without his approve.
It's also not that kind of a 'wish' that's like a 'must have'. Also put it in the end of your list if you accept it.

5. Also I'd suggest some kind of 'elo' ranking and future shufflings that will be depending from elos.
Isn't ELO (or any other rating system) kind of pointless without a matchmaking system and enough players to actually be categorized accordingly? ;)
ELO is pointless without it. But elo is good for:
- Matchmaking system (when shuffle depends on elo, but not on a random numbers)
- For online. It's always motivating people to play for stats. Also if you are planning to release it in the steam.
There are many ways to count that ELO. Also if elo will depend not only on k/d that will make people play better in many ways.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Nanaa on February 02, 2017, 02:41:31 pm
I want to suggest what a prop/gameplay element I posted way back

http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,16379.msg181125.html#msg181125 (http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,16379.msg181125.html#msg181125)

A rebuildable sub/garr, sort of a flag that won't change hands so easily.

That's an interesting idea.

Alternative method to achieve similar result (with probably less work) would be to make spawn flags use capture timers (the same kind Sav Rez uses):
-Wait near flag to capture it.
-With allies around capturing speed is multplied.
-If enemy is near, capturing process stops.
-If flag is owned by enemy, you need to wait x seconds to make enemy lose it and then x seconds to capture it.
-Capture timer is shown as a gui element (a horizontal bar)

(ofc spawn flags are spawn-only, so this isn't quite the same)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on February 02, 2017, 02:44:39 pm
Quote
Alternative method to achieve similar result

Existing scripting could probably do this. I don't know of a way to change the ownership of an existing spawn flag with scripts, but if I recall a spawn flag can be made killable with object file edits, and then the script can kill a flag and replace it with one owned by the desired team.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on February 02, 2017, 03:13:42 pm
And one more thing, something I really wish there'd been when I was making xr_bubbles. A way to block worker pathing without resorting to major height differences. Had to make a very steep shoreline instead of a natural one that could be walked. Would also be useful with maps with lava etc.



Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 02, 2017, 07:36:48 pm
[...crazy dynamic prop ideas here...]
I'm guessing it's just a matter of adding the object, which means Daemon might take a look when he has time inbetween his others tasks.

In case more usable physics objects are added, here's a much needed tweak to go with them: disallow them from damaging buildings. The physics damage to buildings is so minor that it doesn't have real gameplay effect, but with enough time it does allow trolls (who teammates can't kill) to kill their own buildings with them.
I'll consider it - maybe disable damage (to buildings) or maybe disable same-team damage.

[...KingKong_'s crazy idea of a carryable spawn flag dynamic prop...]
Hahahaha!
I don't even know if that's possible. :-D

A way to block worker pathing without resorting to major height differences. Had to make a very steep shoreline instead of a natural one that could be walked.
I don't have enough mapping experience, but aren't there some tools for terrain pathing?


http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,16379.msg181125.html#msg181125 (http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,16379.msg181125.html#msg181125)
A rebuildable sub/garr, sort of a flag that won't change hands so easily.
I'll consider it, it would be another option for mappers to use.
If I take a look, it'll obviously only be as a map-placed prop, much like flags (unbuildable).


My own ideas about this: [ref stuff]
Thank you for the ideas.
I'll see about it, but certain things are restricted to admin, and it'll probably work together with the server's own information and features.

1. An option to add a list of custom commands like:
sv_custom_votes_list = {'k1':v1, 'k2':v2}, where key='new_vote', value=str|number
or if such format is a pain in the ass for C to do it without v:
sv_custom_votes_list = ['key', 'key', 'key']
2. in sv_event.py admin will be able to handle these k/v or just keys:
def callvote(guid, vote_type, vote_info):
    if vote_type and vote_info....
I'm not so sure about this, as the vote system is very...uh...specific... :p
I don't think this one is going to happen.
If there are, however, specific votes you (or others) would like to see added, the success rate is considerably higher.

4. I want more gs_transmits  :-)
There are not enough...? :)
Any other kind of a tool for a server admin to make remote changes on the client side without his approve.
It's also not that kind of a 'wish' that's like a 'must have'.
But the transmits don't actually do anything on client-side anyway, without uploaded scripts and GUI? :?

But elo is good for:
- Matchmaking system (when shuffle depends on elo, but not on a random numbers)
- For online. It's always motivating people to play for stats. Also if you are planning to release it in the steam.
There are many ways to count that ELO. Also if elo will depend not only on k/d that will make people play better in many ways.
I understand the appeal, I do quite like numbers! :-)
I'll consider this, but I'll have to talk to DJ and Groent about it before I even touch it.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Stringer on February 02, 2017, 08:56:31 pm
4. I want more gs_transmits  :-)
There are not enough...? :)
Any other kind of a tool for a server admin to make remote changes on the client side without his approve.
It's also not that kind of a 'wish' that's like a 'must have'.
But the transmits don't actually do anything on client-side anyway, without uploaded scripts and GUI? :?

One of the problems drk ran into when he tried to create his own version of instagib server, was that he wanted clients to have a gui widget specific to that very game mode. And he could not do it without hardcoding that widget into a client-side patch, despite all the flexibility savage clients have regarding creating gui panels.

It feels... incomplete, having all this capabilities in server scripting, yet being unable to finish your project without the hard-coded client patch.

I believe that's what drk is asking for: more capabilities for a server-side-scripted game mode to manipulate clients states (gui and such)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on February 02, 2017, 10:03:03 pm
I believe that's what drk is asking for: more capabilities for a server-side-scripted game mode to manipulate clients states (gui and such)
Yes. Would be good. But as I said it's still should be moved to the end of the wish-list. Not critical if it's not happen.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 02, 2017, 10:08:29 pm
I'm pretty sure it was not the GUI that was the problem.

Maybe you did not have special cvars for your mod that you'd like but which are not native to Savage.

But you can make GUI widgets with scripting just fine, no hardcoding required. GUI is actually NOT hardcoded at all! Code just updates cvars that the GUI script defines widgets for.

He should have asked me if he had issues with this. Or make his GUI and i would have uploaded it with a patch.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 02, 2017, 11:45:25 pm
It feels... incomplete, having all this capabilities in server scripting, yet being unable to finish your project without the hard-coded client patch.

I believe that's what drk is asking for: more capabilities for a server-side-scripted game mode to manipulate clients states (gui and such)
But that's just how it is; if you want custom GUI, you need clients to have it. :-(
You can manually give it to them, or have it shipped as an XR content patch.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on February 03, 2017, 01:05:10 am
Is props which melee hits doesnt go trough possible to get added? would have tons of uses in maps.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 03, 2017, 02:49:22 am
Is props which melee hits doesnt go trough possible to get added?
No, as melee hitting (through objects) is a coded static event and is unrelated to what kind of object/prop it is.
Melee would have to be changed in general and props have nothing to do with it.
Unless you make the prop so big that no one can physically reach through it. :-D


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: balatkit on February 03, 2017, 08:52:42 pm
Game menu could have a better look.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Urien on February 03, 2017, 09:33:11 pm
Yeah, instead of the big ass beige colored UI, can we just have a UI similiar to Sav Rez?

It's much more cleaner and less distracting in my opinion.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on February 03, 2017, 09:34:39 pm

I don't have enough mapping experience, but aren't there some tools for terrain pathing?

As far as I know, the only tool for manipulating pathing is the flood fill point, which can (I assume) give pathing to an otherwise cut off area that's missing it. But I don't think there's anything for blocking pathing, only height difference works.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 03, 2017, 10:11:14 pm
Yeah, instead of the big ass beige colored UI, can we just have a UI similiar to Sav Rez?

It's much more cleaner and less distracting in my opinion.

Go to Options/Game, bottom-left corner, Ingame FPS HUD Interface skin - and see which one you like.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: balatkit on February 03, 2017, 10:26:52 pm
Didn't look through every reply. Hope the loadout bug is on the list.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 03, 2017, 10:28:35 pm
Didn't look through every reply. Hope the loadout bug is on the list.

Care to actually let us know which bug you're referring to?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: balatkit on February 03, 2017, 10:55:56 pm
Didn't look through every reply. Hope the loadout bug is on the list.

Care to actually let us know which bug you're referring to?
May happen no matter what item/unit you pick they won't display in the loadout, yet when you spawn you have them.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 03, 2017, 11:33:42 pm
Hope the loadout bug is on the list.
Care to actually let us know which bug you're referring to?
May happen no matter what item/unit you pick they won't display in the loadout, yet when you spawn you have them.
Is there more information available?
Like how exactly it happens, when it tends to happen, or if it's a specific unit that might cause it.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: balatkit on February 04, 2017, 12:49:03 am
Hope the loadout bug is on the list.
Care to actually let us know which bug you're referring to?
May happen no matter what item/unit you pick they won't display in the loadout, yet when you spawn you have them.
Is there more information available?
Like how exactly it happens, when it tends to happen, or if it's a specific unit that might cause it.
I'll give it a look as to when it happens and make some recording of how it happens some time later I guess. Will submit in the bugs.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 04, 2017, 01:29:27 am
I'll give it a look as to when it happens and make some recording of how it happens some time later I guess. Will submit in the bugs.
Thank you, that will help.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on February 04, 2017, 01:02:32 pm
Samurai and Tombstone have a lot of assets (unit models at least) that could perhaps be used for XR maps. I believe Simply adding those assets to the text file which tells the game which assets to load would allow a map maker to make use of them with objedits. I believeve a map maker could take an existing NPC, change it's model to a tombstone model and make other appropriate changes, by using objedit commands.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on February 04, 2017, 01:31:07 pm
By the way. I had and still having one strange bug.
It depends from the server (or connection?): on gg's it happens, on Pulse - not.
Chat disappears. Panel with frags does not show anything. Only reconnect helps. Could happen when there are many people on the server. Also it happens when you are trying to resign and spawn fast from the com and get back then.
I can try to watch into the logs what is happening in that moment if it happens again.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on February 04, 2017, 01:53:58 pm
Just to be clear, though I suggested a lot of mapping related features, I won't be making any maps myself. A few days of playing on pub reminded my why I don't play this game, the amount of toxicity there just ruins the game for me, and I already need another extended break.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Urien on February 04, 2017, 04:32:01 pm
Yeah, instead of the big ass beige colored UI, can we just have a UI similiar to Sav Rez?

It's much more cleaner and less distracting in my opinion.

Go to Options/Game, bottom-left corner, Ingame FPS HUD Interface skin - and see which one you like.

Oh, thank you Daemon


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Shagroth on February 04, 2017, 09:07:46 pm
There is 1 bug that really can decide games sometimes.

Sometimes a demo requires more than 3 hits on a level +4 pred, however it's impossible for me to reproduce.
There must be a random component happening.
It is also a bug that only appeared in the recent years.

Only thing I know that has been done to demo recently is the behe nerf to it, did the demo change in any way after this?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 04, 2017, 09:49:30 pm
Sometimes a demo requires more than 3 hits on a level +4 pred, however it's impossible for me to reproduce.
There must be a random component happening.
You probably can't reproduce it, because I fixed 3-hit demos a long time ago. :)
If it does still happen anyway, please let me know in more details what leads up to it and which server it is on (might be related), and I'll fix it.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Shagroth on February 04, 2017, 11:00:28 pm
It happened today, I hit the demo with some leaps back and forth cause of dodging hits. But I'm sure I hit it.
I also know I'm not the only one who experienced it, it occurs very rarely however - so work on important things before attempting a squash on this one :) .

Pulse server
not really anything leading up to it, just a normal demo on a sublair.(no one standing on it)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 04, 2017, 11:25:35 pm
It happened today, I hit the demo with some leaps back and forth cause of dodging hits. But I'm sure I hit it.
I also know I'm not the only one who experienced it, it occurs very rarely however
Hmm, random bugs are always my favorite. :-(
I'll see if I can find anything.

Are you sure enough that lag didn't cause it?
And were you certainly level4? (Though level shouldn't matter after the fix anyway.)
And are demos 3 or 4 hits for scav?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 04, 2017, 11:42:39 pm
It happened today, I hit the demo with some leaps back and forth cause of dodging hits. But I'm sure I hit it.
I also know I'm not the only one who experienced it, it occurs very rarely however
Hmm, random bugs are always my favorite. :-(
I'll see if I can find anything.

Are you sure enough that lag didn't cause it?
And were you certainly level4? (Though level shouldn't matter after the fix anyway.)
And are demos 3 or 4 hits for scav?

It's 3 for everyone, it's got the new lives thing, remember? :D


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 05, 2017, 12:35:56 am
It's 3 for everyone, it's got the new lives thing, remember? :D
Hence if it really is 3 for scav, that means it's running the fix. :p
And if it's not, then why isn't it? :roll:


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Ale on February 05, 2017, 09:10:51 am
I can confirm what Shag says. Sometimes its feels like you have disabled it already, move on to the next target and suddenly in explodes anyway. Thing is, it's just a feeling. So it could be that for some reason you havn't hit it three times and your feelings are fooling you (which is more likely than a demo needing 4 hits). Similar things happen to me in duels. I don't actively count the hits I made or the meds the enemy has taken yet I usually know how much more the opponent can take. But sometimes I am wrong. So before filing a bug we should try to reproduce it.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: kLLik on February 05, 2017, 10:05:13 am
hi , about maps: new textures, new objects, water layer(realistic), shadows(not with paint :-)) etc etc , will be something new??


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Captain Kenway on February 05, 2017, 12:33:32 pm
I have experienced 4 hits for demo A LOT in the last 5 months, the problem is certainly there. Doesnt matter with which unit I hit it, nor the level I am.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Gridfon on February 05, 2017, 01:09:42 pm
I have experienced 4 hits for demo A LOT in the last 5 months, the problem is certainly there. Doesnt matter with which unit I hit it, nor the level I am.

This is true. I saw this bug happening a lot, and it happened regularly (easily more than once per day). Some 4-5 months ago. I heard the same complaints from numerous other players. It happened both on Pulse and on GK.

What confuses me is that at some point over the span of these 4-5 months it went from "very regularly" to "very rarely". Not sure why; may be the frequency of this bug is my subjective perception based on my activity. I did gradually go inactive.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 05, 2017, 03:08:21 pm
I have experienced 4 hits for demo A LOT in the last 5 months, the problem is certainly there. Doesnt matter with which unit I hit it, nor the level I am.
This is true. I saw this bug happening a lot, and it happened regularly (easily more than once per day). Some 4-5 months ago. I heard the same complaints from numerous other players. It happened both on Pulse and on GK.
I better bring some over-night snacks.


hi , about maps: new textures, new objects, water layer(realistic), shadows(not with paint :-)) etc etc , will be something new??
That depends on if Daemon has the time for new stuff or if someone else makes them.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on February 06, 2017, 09:17:26 am
Requesting a cap on the turnspeed behemots have - to prevent 360 degree multikills. They should be slow to turn, and in that way, make them a lot more useless for defensive purposes.

Not sure if technically possible. Daemon wrote something about that behemots belonged to siege class, and that is wasnt possible some time ago,but I think its worth mentioning nonetheless.


Edit: if possible to implement, I think this should be pretty high up on the priority list, as it solves quite a lot of camping problems in general gameplay, both at sublairs and flags.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 06, 2017, 09:41:52 am
Requesting a cap on the turnspeed behemots have - to prevent 360 degree multikills. They should be slow to turn, and in that way, make them a lot more useless for defensive purposes.

Not sure if technically possible. Daemon wrote something about that behemots belonged to siege class, and that is wasnt possible some time ago,but I think its worth mentioning nonetheless.


Edit: if possible to implement, I think this should be pretty high up on the priority list, as it solves quite a lot of camping problems in general gameplay, both at sublairs and flags.

http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/board,126.0.html


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 06, 2017, 11:15:30 am
Sounds like it's worth another try. Will open a discussion.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 06, 2017, 11:43:05 am
While we're at discussions again, make eject units health based on health percentage. if you had 5% life left as ballista you should have 5% left as nomad too. :-p


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Urien on February 07, 2017, 01:44:52 am
I have experienced 4 hits for demo A LOT in the last 5 months, the problem is certainly there. Doesnt matter with which unit I hit it, nor the level I am.
This is true. I saw this bug happening a lot, and it happened regularly (easily more than once per day). Some 4-5 months ago. I heard the same complaints from numerous other players. It happened both on Pulse and on GK.
I better bring some over-night snacks.


hi , about maps: new textures, new objects, water layer(realistic), shadows(not with paint :-)) etc etc , will be something new??
That depends on if Daemon has the time for new stuff or if someone else makes them.



Wasn't there a modder who made a graphic pack? I think it was Natsu.

And it would definitely be nice to have a graphic upgrade. While sav rez may not have been as good as XR, UE4 sure was pretty


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 07, 2017, 02:57:50 am
Wasn't there a modder who made a graphic pack? I think it was Natsu.
Yes, Natsu made a graphics pack, but it wasn't strictly an upgrade as it was just based on his personal preferences.
Unfortunately, while certain things were improved, other changes affected gameplay in negative ways and certain things were even downgrades.

Nonetheless, it was offered to him to be added to XR as an alternative graphics pack to give players the option to pick which one they liked. However, he refused the offer and demanded it instead completely replace XR's standard graphics despite the aforementioned issues with it. During any possible discussions over the topic and possible adjustments to suit the required criteria better, he has thrown out a series of insults and slurs to back up his demands.

While I am more than welcome to add alternative graphics packs for players to choose from (I specifically coded the option a long time ago), and even replace the standard ones with well-made and well-thought out upgrades, Natsu's work is unsuitable for either at this point.

Other applicants are welcome.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Necrophiliac on February 07, 2017, 03:44:45 pm
He's American and likes anime, what do you expect?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 07, 2017, 06:01:01 pm
He's American and likes anime, what do you expect?
There is no need for this.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Shitler on February 07, 2017, 08:26:30 pm
Behespawn should not be able to do any damage for first 5 sec to prevent behespawning.

And please remove refs like Soma who only support their own team, dont slay/kick exploiters, stop legit kickvotes against exploiters and lie to people with telling them they arent able to slay/kick. Please don't give people of low intelligence too much power. This is a reason why servers are empty. No more gg's these days.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 07, 2017, 08:48:55 pm
Behespawn should not be able to do any damage for first 5 sec to prevent behespawning.
Worth discussing together with all the other anti-camping (and anti-behe-camping) suggestions in a rebalancing thread.

And please remove refs like Soma who only support their own team, dont slay/kick exploiters, stop legit kickvotes against exploiters and lie to people with telling them they arent able to slay/kick.
How do you propose I "patch" this?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 07, 2017, 10:20:38 pm
Crash, i need help with getting caves to work! :) They get all sorts of weird lighting because the game was designed to be outdoors :).

At least rain droplets don't penetrate the cave walls :).


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 10, 2017, 02:16:19 am
(Quoting here instead of the other thread.)

I do have one important suggestion that I think has been overlooked. Shuffle and even votes are broken and need to be fixed. Shuffle should randomize players into teams while even votes should place players evenly according to K/D ratio (stats) for balance, those alone would help make the game less stacky and more enjoyable.
I might revamp the shuffle code, since it has already come to attention causing problems in 4 team maps.
But what do you actually mean by "broken" and "need to be fixed"?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Shagroth on February 10, 2017, 07:44:22 pm
med switch bug!!! before i forget it cause im too used to it!
Making a swing instead of using an item.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 10, 2017, 07:47:14 pm
That's cooldown + item switch time required by information to go back and forth + too early clicking on the item that never came.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: balatkit on February 11, 2017, 03:40:09 pm
-Swapping items on loadout screen.

-Not really important but would also like to have items fixed to a certain position in loadout, e.g. when I get Frenzy and Mana Crystal I'd want Frenzy to be 3rd and Mana 4th regardless of the buy order.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Crashday on February 11, 2017, 04:31:05 pm
seems i commented the wrong thread -,-

voice sounds for 3/4 team games seem to be bugged.
e.g.: t1 attacks t2 sublair, t3 gets voice sounds "We are attacking their sublair"
same goes for all other buildings and team combinations

  • Fix behe swing animation not showing, rarely

i have also seen this bug for legos and preds. funnily ive never encountered it with other units, though.
do not know how to reproduce :S

ive quite recently encountered a weird bug where i built a shield and the blue line thingie clearly showed that my garrison would be shielded. ultimately it wasnt and my team was cut off from the battlefield due to my buildings blocking their way.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: balatkit on February 11, 2017, 04:43:26 pm
Have you heard of a bug (I know it works for Scavenger, didn't test as Nomad) when auto-repair/mine animations (which is called by "R" -- auto-mine/repair button -- by default) won't work at times when you are mining/repairing (instead, there's attack animations, and when you click attack button there is repair animations)?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Nanaa on February 11, 2017, 05:03:49 pm
The chat has a bug where icon's path is shown instead of the icon (see chatbug.png). Smiley is transformed into its path "^icon ../smiles/1^" and I guess the chat doens't check the path got a lenght and thus can't properly make a line break. So the string is cut off when the character limit hits.

Team selection screen's chat works as it should (see chatbug2.png)

Additional info:
Smileys can also cause that words at the end of sentences are not shown.

Resolution: 1920x1080
Hud skin: Smoke


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 11, 2017, 05:43:23 pm
seems i commented the wrong thread -,-
No worries, I read both anyway. :mrgreen:


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Crashday on February 11, 2017, 07:03:59 pm
there seems to be a bug regarding swapping items in loadout screen when having low gold.

e.g.: Let's say i have 100 gold left and rabid (250$) + frenzy (800$) equipped. team gold is 0$ / blocked by comm.
it is not possible to swap rabid with let's say something from equal value like carni (250$). i have to explicitly sell rabid before buying carni.

its a minor issue i guess :)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 12, 2017, 12:01:52 am
Mobile spawn point!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Grapists on February 12, 2017, 08:12:44 am
@Daemon Is the cave just a prop or something you can build out of terrain in the map editor to be more customizable?

Also let djinghis join the newerth high council. #FreeDjinghis #CounselorInghis


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 12, 2017, 09:25:42 am
@Daemon Is the cave just a prop or something you can build out of terrain in the map editor to be more customizable?

It's the 1st of many modular cave segments, to be used by map makers as soon as we figure out the lighting issues.

Also let djinghis join the newerth high council. #FreeDjinghis #CounselorInghis

Nothing high about it. It's for trustworthy people thou. Why would you even obsess over djinghis?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: SavageBeard on February 12, 2017, 09:53:36 am
Mobile spawn point!

Cool stuff, is it buildable or a prop? Can change hands? How to prevent humans just hiding it in their base?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 12, 2017, 10:37:54 am
Will post soon, we need figure out all the details and make it work.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 12, 2017, 11:51:49 am
The only thing i really liked about Savage 2 were the mobile spawn points. So this is pretty much amazing, even if not useful nowadays as not any big maps are being played anymore.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: SavageBeard on February 12, 2017, 01:02:49 pm
Crash, i need help with getting caves to work! :) They get all sorts of weird lighting because the game was designed to be outdoors :).

At least rain droplets don't penetrate the cave walls :).

Since you're on the mission to create caves and stuff,

Any chance to create some more objects that can be used like Grimm's walls? Specifically I'm thinking of large boulders (some which are quite big, that the team can kill to expand their base for example), also trees and other types of props.

Or even adjust the editor so that each object can be assigned HP and so on, so that the map maker can chose which objects to make destructible and with which amount of HP.

Also I have found the amount of different ladders to be very lacking. Most of them don't scale well at all, you have to use many different ones, and most are used as an incline. It would be nice to have some sort of ladder prop which is almost vertical, and quite small (just a rope of some sorts?) that you can scale to a decent height if you want without it looking wonky.


On an unrelated note I also want to bring another suggestion (which I posted somewhere way back, can't remember where), and that is a slight balance change to allow units to carry more redstone (100 or 150).

And the more controversial suggestion that siege units hitting regular units should stun them (for 2-3 secs) instead of inflicting damage.  :mrgreen:


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 12, 2017, 01:23:58 pm
Post in the re-balancing section for gameplay changes, i really can't keep track of everything. Plus, we need to see discussions and arguments brought to the table to make us resonate with one's proposals.

http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,17471.0.html

Making anything a grimm wall in the editor is a a grim feat. So someone, you maybe, better put a list together of exactly what should be new grimm-like props: appearance, size, HP, etc.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: SavageBeard on February 12, 2017, 03:01:31 pm
Post in the re-balancing section for gameplay changes, i really can't keep track of everything. Plus, we need to see discussions and arguments brought to the table to make us resonate with one's proposals.

http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,17471.0.html

Making anything a grimm wall in the editor is a a grim feat. So someone, you maybe, better put a list together of exactly what should be new grimm-like props: appearance, size, HP, etc.

Ah, apprently I had already put my suggestion in that thread

I have made a map with some props I want to see destructible and their approx. size. Would be nice to have some new boulder though, since that one is getting quite overused.

Also would like to see some mashed up props exist as a unified destructible like the one scene to the left in the map, in this case it can be walked across from one side but not the other.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 12, 2017, 05:45:11 pm
[Stuff about more walls, more trees, more props, and more ladders]
We'll be adding more props in general, but the more specific wishes people list, the more likely variety will be added.
At the same time, it's still at Daemon's own discretion since he needs to not only add them, but also actually make/adjust them.

Or even adjust the editor so that each object can be assigned HP and so on, so that the map maker can chose which objects to make destructible and with which amount of HP.
This is unfeasible as the editor does not work like that.
Since it's just a map editor, you only use the existing defitions to make your map and not actually creating your own objects.
What a mapper can do, however, is add a startup script to objedit the object definitions on load.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Marbello on February 12, 2017, 06:47:41 pm
This, also the server file from our download section! I just have to download hundreds of new MB's due to a fresh install :(

(http://i.imgur.com/aevB2s2.jpg)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Necrophiliac on February 12, 2017, 07:27:32 pm
There was recently (6 months ago) a problem with some of the windows download for the game. Not sure if this was fixed, if someone could check all 3 links that would be great. Not sure that it matters if the game is coming to steam  :wink: Just thought I would mention it.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: SavageBeard on February 12, 2017, 08:01:17 pm
[Stuff about more walls, more trees, more props, and more ladders]
We'll be adding more props in general, but the more specific wishes people list, the more likely variety will be added.
At the same time, it's still at Daemon's own discretion since he needs to not only add them, but also actually make/adjust them.

Or even adjust the editor so that each object can be assigned HP and so on, so that the map maker can chose which objects to make destructible and with which amount of HP.
This is unfeasible as the editor does not work like that.
Since it's just a map editor, you only use the existing defitions to make your map and not actually creating your own objects.
What a mapper can do, however, is add a startup script to objedit the object definitions on load.

I think I tried that a while back, and if I remember right there were issues with the rotation of the objects, not to mention that it's all very hard to get into due to lack of documentation. You might be talking about something else, though.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Marbello on February 12, 2017, 10:20:25 pm
(..)  if someone could check all 3 links that would be great. Not sure that it matters if the game is coming to steam (..)

No way, that'd be awesome!!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 12, 2017, 11:48:41 pm
I think I tried that a while back, and if I remember right there were issues with the rotation of the objects, not to mention that it's all very hard to get into due to lack of documentation. You might be talking about something else, though.
I'm talking about setting up an interval trigger that loads up a startup.cfg once at the beginning of the match that makes use of !exec null "objedit object_name"
!exec null "objset fullhealth 10000"
In case the .cfg at map load can't handle the objedit and objset itself.

Essentially editing the object definition (e.g. the grimms wall) to suit your needs for this round.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on February 13, 2017, 06:16:11 pm
The chat has a bug where icon's path is shown instead of the icon (see chatbug.png). Smiley is transformed into its path "^icon ../smiles/1^" and I guess the chat doens't check the path got a lenght and thus can't properly make a line break. So the string is cut off when the character limit hits.

Team selection screen's chat works as it should (see chatbug2.png)
+1 to this. It would be good to fix this bug.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 13, 2017, 06:55:04 pm
I'm quite sure this is caused by the fact that the game doesn't properly match the ratio between character width, resolution and chat size on each individual desktop. Amazingly, the same font does not look the same on every machine, i've tested it first hand.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 14, 2017, 06:51:23 am
Auras!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on February 14, 2017, 10:51:36 am
Auras!
Looks awesome  :mrgreen:


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Marbello on February 14, 2017, 06:06:52 pm
This might be server-side suggestion. How about specs joining get as well the EXP increase - just as newly connected players? Or diminishing both!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 14, 2017, 11:54:02 pm
This, also the server file from our download section! I just have to download hundreds of new MB's due to a fresh install :(
I'll see if, after the patch, I can push Newerth to supply a new installer.

This might be server-side suggestion. How about specs joining get as well the EXP increase - just as newly connected players? Or diminishing both!
Sure, why not!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 15, 2017, 05:32:08 pm
Fix level 21 rainbow armor. Or edit the expedit! :)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 15, 2017, 05:39:20 pm
Fix level 21 rainbow armor. Or edit the expedit! :)
I'll investigate. Would help a lot to know exactly which armor parts are broken.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 15, 2017, 05:56:13 pm
I reported it to Clemens. The bug exists for years now, it did seem to work (from what I know) in 2009. I tried it myself with exp tables, but it doesn't seem to work at all anymore.

Basically every armor part is 'broken' if it comes to the rainbow armor. It should change it's color but doesn't seem to do so anymore.


(Also was the armor lvl 3 color made grey intentional?)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 15, 2017, 06:05:32 pm
Fix level 21 rainbow armor. Or edit the expedit! :)
I'll investigate. Would help a lot to know exactly which armor parts are broken.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 15, 2017, 06:11:34 pm
Nevermind but thank you Daemon. Seems to be working for everyone but me.  :-(


EDIT: Problem seems to be that I playeda round with the exptables once on my client, a fresh install does fix it tho!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 16, 2017, 05:29:37 pm
Add /callvote msgcomm to the possible callvotes in the list.

Go ingame and type /callvote in the chat. It is not listed there, you might add it! (Just so it's complete!)


Maybe remove "ask X" too. It was used by Uttar at some point but has no real use anymore. (Or just remove it from the list when you type "ask" in the console)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 16, 2017, 06:44:09 pm
Add /callvote msgcomm to the possible callvotes in the list.
Go ingame and type /callvote in the chat. It is not listed there, you might add it! (Just so it's complete!)
Everything is in the list, but only votes that are valid at that specific moment are shown.
While msg can be any time, msgcomm can only be during a match (=GAME_STATUS_NORMAL), and thus will only appear in the list during a match.

Maybe remove "ask X" too. It was used by Uttar at some point but has no real use anymore. (Or just remove it from the list when you type "ask" in the console)
Uh, sure... :p


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on February 16, 2017, 08:11:09 pm
By the way: would be good to make small bugfix in the gui: to hide a panel with resources/sh-lair hp when you dont spectate anybody.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on February 16, 2017, 10:39:53 pm
Requesting bug fix: Balista projectile got marked as target.

proof: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1gpTwfEsdA_YW4zMTllbXRqS3c/view?usp=sharing

Its a demo file from a game tonight. Fast forward til about 19:55, and do max slow motion. Around 19:58-20:00 you will see a balista projectile gets marked as target by either commander or some officer. Not sure which one, but i was a normal fieldplayer when i got the order.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 16, 2017, 11:25:07 pm
Right now if you have too many .demo files in your /game/demo directory savage will crash if you click on the 'Demo' tab on the main menu. Maybe there's some way that savage doesn't crash like splitting it up into pages?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Tzvi on February 16, 2017, 11:38:14 pm
If to pick something good from SavRez.
Disable Spec ability to "Spy" on a team/comm and pm a player/comm on the other team what is happening..

As a comm I experience that feeling.. I make a sneak garr or choose a sneaky tactic and I see some trolls in spec.. (like Djinghis/Grapist or just someone I had an argument with).. next thing I know I get countered or spotted in the middle of the plan.


So shortly:
1) Specs should not be able to pm non-specs
2) Specs should not be able to chat on pub (or maybe this can be solved by more refs to moderate pub chat)
3) Specs should not be able to participate in draw votes in my opinion.

TRA


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 16, 2017, 11:46:35 pm
If to pick something good from SavRez.
Disable Spec ability to "Spy" on a team/comm and pm a player/comm on the other team what is happening..

So shortly:
1) Specs should not be able to pm non-specs
2) Specs should not be able to chat on pub (or maybe this can be solved by more refs to moderate pub chat)
There are too many ways around this.
Foremost, using external programs to chat or talk.
Secondly, you can all chat (this will not be disabled).
Thirdly, even if all chat was disabled, you can start a msg vote.
Fourthly, even if we disable all chat and msg votes, you can change your name to give out hints.
Fifthly, you can join the enemy team and tell them directly.
Sixthly, if the enemy team is full, you can get someone else to join the other team for a moment.
And seventhly, you could also just join the team you want to spy on and then use all chat or PM to warn the enemy team.

It would not stop people from spying, and it would greatly diminish the enjoyment from everyone else.

3) Specs should not be able to participate in draw votes in my opinion.
They could just join a team to vote and then retreat back to spec.
So if enough people want this, I'll do it anyway, but otherwise it basically does nothing.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 17, 2017, 12:20:54 am
How about allowing /ref destroy to aim at objects like grimms_walls too? Could help when peoples are exploiting to actually just kil lthe wall...


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on February 17, 2017, 12:23:24 am
Simple feature addon suggestion, deeply needed : Profany filter.


there is a game called "town of salem" which have it, and it turns all swearing, racism etc and nasty insults into random gibberish.

I think such a feature could be useful in savage aswell, as the community language isnt particulary "inviting" to new people. Take a look at Rin for instance.

and of course- the filter should be optionally, and able to turn on/off in settings.

No idea how much work it will be, if too much - dont prioritize it :)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 17, 2017, 12:47:49 am
Simple feature addon suggestion, deeply needed : Profany filter.
it turns all swearing, racism etc and nasty insults into random gibberish.
and of course- the filter should be optionally, and able to turn on/off in settings.
This already exists, but is off by default.
\game\filter.cfg
If you open console and type in "exec filter.cfg" it'll work.

Maybe I'll turn it on... :roll:


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 17, 2017, 01:12:35 am
Simple feature addon suggestion, deeply needed : Profany filter.
it turns all swearing, racism etc and nasty insults into random gibberish.
and of course- the filter should be optionally, and able to turn on/off in settings.
This already exists, but is off by default.
\game\filter.cfg
If you open console and type in "exec filter.cfg" it'll work.

Maybe I'll turn it on... :roll:

In some cases it does not work. If this it he case type "cl_filter_filter 1" in your console and try again.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 17, 2017, 01:27:34 am
In some cases it does not work. If this it he case type "cl_filter_filter 1" in your console and try again.
It's 1 by default, so if it's not, the person manually set it to 0. :?

And before anyone cheeky types in "cvarlist cl_filter_" and asks if they're related to cl_filter_filter, the answer is no.  :-P
According to the code (if they still work), it's for ignoring messages.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Necrophiliac on February 17, 2017, 03:43:00 am
This game finally gets an update and people are asking for profanity filters and chat bans.... are you trying to kill the small community that is left?
Please don't waste your time on this kind of stuff :/


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Astronis on February 17, 2017, 08:11:17 am
Hey there,


I wonder if for the the next patch you could work on removing the ability for behespawners to protect sub-lairs and spawn flags.

It is way too often that when Human try to push the sub it is easily coutnered by one behe spawner that can clear the whole push and allow beast to counterpush. This happens almost everytime that you go for a demo run. It is REALLY annoying to play against as Human and it's just an dirty gimmick that ruins the sportmanship of the game. It also happens that behe spawners block ballista shots on the sub from far away.


It would be nice if you could offer some improvements in that area since it would make games much better and less dirty.


My suggestions are:

1. Create an small Area of Effect around the Sub-Lair in which behes aren't allowed to attack, this will allow hums to hug the sub lair with the demo without being interfered by the behe. If they try to attack it will not work and you will display a message in red text "Shame on you you dirty behe spawner, not so funny now aren't ya, you little cunt"

2. Refs should be more strict in this case and kick behe spawners for atleast 2 hours. This will make people think twice about behe spawning at the sub.

3. The demo explosion effect that was implemented before was a great idea. I know it was abused but it should learn them to not behe spawn when the team turn against them.


EDIT: It would also be great if you could add a new Helmet for the Savage Unit, or give the option to disable helmets for Units.


Would be happy to see if some content regarding this was released :)

Thanks for working hard on this game, good work!

Best Regards

Astronis


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on February 17, 2017, 09:06:42 am
It also happens that behe spawners block ballista shots on the sub from far away.
Why not? Siege vs siege. All is fine in this case.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Tzvi on February 17, 2017, 09:13:52 am
There are too many ways around this.
Foremost, using external programs to chat or talk.
If a bunch of trolls and a playing team comm/player want to group-up in a random pub game just to use team-speak for spying then it's out of any game developer's hand at this moment.
But in 99% of the time no-one will take the extent to do it just to ruin a small pub game (which in most times we are talking about 7-8 players on each team which are pretty randomly sorted).

Secondly, you can all chat (this will not be disabled).
It was disabled in SavRez and I thought it was a good idea.
But ok, then just disable pms IMO.

Thirdly, even if all chat was disabled, you can start a msg vote.
A vote message will reveal the identity of the troll and hence he will have to face:
1) community shaming
2) ref punishment
3) awareness of the "victim" commander he is being spied against (might give him some leeway to react).
hence making it less prone to spying as a whole and lowering spying potential negative impact.
This is also true for "all chat"

Fourthly, even if we disable all chat and msg votes, you can change your name to give out hints.
So again just make it harder by disabling pms to non-specs.. which is the easiest way to spy without any community repercussions.
Fifthly, you can join the enemy team and tell them directly.
You can, but again in this case it would be kinda clear this is what you did and the other team's comm will not be able to react as fast as he can through real-time pms.

Sixthly, if the enemy team is full, you can get someone else to join the other team for a moment.
And seventhly, you could also just join the team you want to spy on and then use all chat or PM to warn the enemy team.

So as said.. you are correct we cannot stop spying, nor should we disable "alll" chat.
What we can do by disabling spec pms to non-spec is make it:
1) Significantly harder (which can be very important since delaying the "spy time" can mean your tactic will be efficient nonetheless)
2) Assuming ppl don't group-up for team-chat/live online stream just for a simple pub match then revealing the spy identity is rather easy.. and it cannot sustain forever such revealing forms of spying since people are changing teams and not "sticking" with their fellow spies (at least nowadays, I don't know what the future holds).
making a spy face the wrath of the community and prone to refs punishments should be enough to lower the risks.


I believe one of the biggest problems Savage is facing today is skilled players don't want to comm from various reasons (and the server gradually empties-up while waiting for 2 comms):
Could be obvious sac rushes which you can't counter efficiently.
Could be the knowledge you will probably be spied against if certain trolls are in spec and you leave a temporary hole in your shield just to tech-up faster.
Could be just a noob team you don't wanna comm.

Of course we cannot handle all those reasons.. but if we help lower the risk of any of the reasons we make Savage more attractive IMO (this is why I also support moving sac to lvl2 and fixing the shuffle vote which sorts players unevenly in sheer numbers).


And I think disabling the spec pm option is rather easy to implement?

Quick Summary :) if you don't want to read it all, IMO today it's just too-easy to anonymously spy.
Another way to lower risk is just give god-refs the ability to spec PMs (and punish spies or at least open a forum thread about who was spying).
This could however be a problem that refs would be able to read plain gossip.. but IDK.. (I still think disabling PMs is the best route).

TRA

P.S
Come play with us on pub Clemens..:P




Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Astronis on February 17, 2017, 09:45:16 am
It also happens that behe spawners block ballista shots on the sub from far away.
Why not? Siege vs siege. All is fine in this case.

Well humans don't have siege weapons that can block behe attack or summ shot, it's unfair imo.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 17, 2017, 10:26:55 am
Take re-balancing out of this thread, please. Link in 1st post.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Necrophiliac on February 17, 2017, 12:09:36 pm

1. Create an small Area of Effect around the Sub-Lair in which behes aren't allowed to attack, this will allow hums to hug the sub lair with the demo without being interfered by the behe. If they try to attack it will not work and you will display a message in red text "Shame on you you dirty behe spawner, not so funny now aren't ya, you little cunt"


We need that message to be implemented word for word. Get on it daemon and clemens!  :angel:


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 17, 2017, 05:22:23 pm
P.S
Come play with us on pub Clemens..:P
I wish I had the time. :-(
I've been spending nearly all my free time coding this patch.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: APirateHat on February 17, 2017, 10:42:23 pm
Simple feature addon suggestion, deeply needed : Profany filter.


there is a game called "town of salem" which have it, and it turns all swearing, racism etc and nasty insults into random gibberish.

I think such a feature could be useful in savage aswell, as the community language isnt particulary "inviting" to new people. Take a look at Rin for instance.

and of course- the filter should be optionally, and able to turn on/off in settings.

No idea how much work it will be, if too much - dont prioritize it :)


http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,17283.0.html


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on February 17, 2017, 10:56:41 pm
http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,17283.0.html

Thank you!  :bow:


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Shagroth on February 19, 2017, 01:07:44 pm
After playing shaman for 1 hour just now i realized there is something missing. :shaman:

  • A sound that lets you know you are hitting something with shield, maybe just a brigher version of the current shaman shielding sound
  • At rewards screen, it only says revives not amount of healing done. Shouldn't be hard to add in healing done?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 19, 2017, 03:14:55 pm
After playing shaman for 1 hour just now i realized there is something missing. :shaman:

A sound that lets you know you are hitting something with shield, maybe just a brigher version of the current shaman shielding sound

Well there is a sound (and i added it along with a purple effect too) when hitting something with shield, but originates at the target, so if you're far away, you may not hear it.

At rewards screen, it only says revives not amount of healing done. Shouldn't be hard to add in healing done?

Even if it would say healing done, the game and the DB only store revives, not healed HP.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on February 19, 2017, 04:04:12 pm
A small quality of life improvement: an option to automatically ignore all whispers, but not public chat. The main usage of whispers is to send insult spam without refs noticing, and I could do without that.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on February 19, 2017, 04:06:28 pm
Quote
Even if it would say healing done, the game and the DB only store revives, not healed HP.

I think the award itself counts healer XP? Displaying that might make more sense, since it's not actually based on revives.

And on the topic of awards, changing Flag Thief to also count Auto-miners, sawmills etc. might be a good idea. Some maps are all about capturing auto-miners, having that reflected in awards would be nice.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 19, 2017, 08:19:43 pm
At rewards screen, it only says revives not amount of healing done. Shouldn't be hard to add in healing done?
Even if it would say healing done, the game and the DB only store revives, not healed HP.
I think the award itself counts healer XP? Displaying that might make more sense, since it's not actually based on revives.
The award is granted to the most Healer XP, and shows total revives as a bonus.
If it's just for the award screen, I can fudge in Healer XP instead without affecting the stats DB.
The question is if both has enough room, or we need to pick one of them.

And on the topic of awards, changing Flag Thief to also count Auto-miners, sawmills etc. might be a good idea. Some maps are all about capturing auto-miners, having that reflected in awards would be nice.
But "Flag Thief" is specifically claiming spawnpoints, aka flags.
Adding the others to it would ruin the point of what it is. :)
I can replace the award with something else instead, but the DB will still only count flags.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 20, 2017, 08:52:59 pm
A small quality of life improvement: an option to automatically ignore all whispers, but not public chat. The main usage of whispers is to send insult spam without refs noticing, and I could do without that.
That's probably what "cl_filter_private" is for, but I don't think it works.
I'll consider it.

But demorecords and server admins do notice PMs, so if that's an issue, report them accordingly.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on February 21, 2017, 03:49:54 pm
Requesting filters for picking maps when calling a vote, in the vote panel. The reason is quite the simple: The current scroll down option takes forever if your map starts with a letter far down in the alphabet. Not to mention - savage have 4000 maps. Oranizing them in some sort on the client could be useful, atleast where you are interacting with them - in the voting panel.

Such as:

xr maps (maps with xr_ in front)
duel maps (maps with _duel_ in its name (reg exp)
sep_ maps (maps with sep_ in front)
samurai maps  (you get what i mean now)
Normal maps
Classics (made by s2games)
3-team maps (regardless of name prefix)
4- team maps (regardless of name prefix)

Edit: A even better thing would be a search box for the map name, disregarding the prefixes (xr, sep etc)
Edit2: Added 3-team maps and 4-team maps as requested filters


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on February 21, 2017, 05:30:58 pm
Requesting fix for showing correct teamscores:

1. Make them independent of a persons stats. Example: I join  T1, kill 4 guys, dies 6 times. Teamscore is now in human team (if its only me in the team) 4/6.    IF I leave t1 and join t2, humans looses my stats from the teamscore - such that is it 0/0, and beasts gets 4/6 in teamscore. This is flawed logic. In large games where some players manage to get over 100 kills, the teamscore might get really wrong and misleading.

You can easely reproduce this logical flaw by joining a server, kill/die a couple of times and then join the other team, and look how the teamscores changed.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 21, 2017, 05:36:44 pm
Looks perfectly legit to me...

Because a person is still part of the team thus a persons stats is part of the teams stats.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on February 21, 2017, 05:40:01 pm
Looks perfectly legit to me...

Because a person is still part of the team thus a persons stats is part of the teams stats.

No, because your human kills and deaths transfer to the other team if you swap. It doesnt make any sense with 0/0 in human teamscore and 4/6 on beasts - when all those stats was gained as a human player. Its simple logic. It should not be locked to person. Each kill a team does, need to be stored separately, such that it shows all kills/deaths a team have during a game, regardless if the player leaves, changes team or  crashes.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on February 21, 2017, 05:50:42 pm
Im on a streak.

Requesting fix for spectating . Currently you can spectate dead bodies of both teams, npc's etc, anyone on the field.

The following fix:
- Only be able to spectate people on same team which are alive
- Upon death be aauto-switched to loadout screen, but can still be revived while respawntimer goes down, as long as you dont respawn, buy things/items/weapons or request gold.


The reason: enforce competetive play. I dont know how many times I have died scouting a area, just to see, as a dead player, the enemy team construct a sub/garr, and I warned the team (while dead)


Currently you can, as a dead player on a team:
1. Specate npcs
2. Specate dead teammates bodies
3. spectate teammates (obviously)

How I did it:
1. join team online, die to something. Press space and right click to switch between people and stuff while you are dead.

P.s No idea how I got to specate npc, but it most often happened when right clicking. Space didnt seem to bring me to npcs.



Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 21, 2017, 06:25:51 pm
Looks perfectly legit to me...

Because a person is still part of the team thus a persons stats is part of the teams stats.

No, because your human kills and deaths transfer to the other team if you swap. It doesnt make any sense with 0/0 in human teamscore and 4/6 on beasts - when all those stats was gained as a human player. Its simple logic. It should not be locked to person. Each kill a team does, need to be stored separately, such that it shows all kills/deaths a team have during a game, regardless if the player leaves, changes team or  crashes.

Right now that's the only way to see if a team is stacked. Also If you swap you as player still have 4-6 while your team has 0-0. That would make absolutely no sense to me as a spectator nor commander. On the other hand I see more disadvantages than advantages in adding this. What is it's actually gain for the human team if they have 200 kills more or less?

Im on a streak.

Requesting fix for spectating . Currently you can spectate dead bodies of both teams, npc's etc, anyone on the field.

The following fix:
- Only be able to spectate people on same team which are alive
- Upon death be aauto-switched to loadout screen, but can still be revived while respawntimer goes down, as long as you dont respawn, buy things/items/weapons or request gold.


The reason: enforce competetive play. I dont know how many times I have died scouting a area, just to see, as a dead player, the enemy team construct a sub/garr, and I warned the team (while dead)

In a clanwar if you stay dead to just scout brings you the overview over subs and tech probably but your team is still missing one player. And it doesn't change the outcome. In all my CW experience I never heard or saw someone complaining about that. No offense, but have you actually ever played clanwars?

On public it doesn't matter anyway, as there are so many players around sneak garrs and subs are rarely possible to do.

It might be nice to have this optionally implemented but it feels like it'll be never used by any competition nor server admin ever.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 21, 2017, 06:46:02 pm
Requesting filters for picking maps when calling a vote, in the vote panel.
I'll consider it, but GUI requests are always uncertain as things are coded in stupidly strict ways.

You can easely reproduce this logical flaw by joining a server, kill/die a couple of times and then join the other team, and look how the teamscores changed.
It's not flawed, as it's the combined score of all players on that team from this match.
If it was the team's score, sure, but it's not - that's your misconception.
Regardless, maybe we can have both!

Requesting fix for spectating . Currently you can spectate dead bodies of both teams, npc's etc, anyone on the field.
The following fix:
- Only be able to spectate people on same team which are alive
- Upon death be aauto-switched to loadout screen, but can still be revived while respawntimer goes down, as long as you dont respawn, buy things/items/weapons or request gold.
I don't think this is happening, because it's coded in a way where entering loadout removes your link to the body as you're already filling up a new one with stuff and the corpse begins rotting. Which is also why you can't revive them anymore. I'll think about it.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on February 21, 2017, 07:17:36 pm
Regarding teamscores:

Right now that's the only way to see if a team is stacked.

No, teamscores in savage are not even, because the races are assymmetrical, and they vary alot depending on mapsize etc. its a horrible way to judge if a team is stacked, especially in long, late games. Early on I agree it can be useful though, except for sac rushes.. But dont you think you can judge if a game is stacked equally well, just by looking at each players individual score? if the majoriy of your team is negative in k/d ratio, its likely to be stacked.

Also If you swap you as player still have 4-6 while your team has 0-0. That would make absolutely no sense to me as a spectator nor commander. On the other hand I see more disadvantages than advantages in adding this. What is it's actually gain for the human team if they have 200 kills more or less?

As I have said, the teamscore doesnt fit particulary well to indicate stacked teams. So what purpose does it serve? Personally I would love to give it a new purpose- showing how the match evolved in post-game, showing up teamscore for every 10th minute of the game, and its corresponding teamscores at such time.

Imagine something like this:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1gpTwfEsdA_T0dIT3RNb3VFWkU/view?usp=sharing (https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1gpTwfEsdA_T0dIT3RNb3VFWkU/view?usp=sharing)    (its a picture made in paint in my google drive folder)

Showing how each team played during the game, and showing up at the end of the game ( it would need to be two bars, one for each team).

In a clanwar if you stay dead to just scout brings you the overview over subs and tech probably but your team is still missing one player. And it doesn't change the outcome. In all my CW experience I never heard or saw someone complaining about that. No offense, but have you actually ever played clanwars?


Regarding the specator "bug"
The reason noone have complained is because everyone does it, so its acceptable. From a competetive P.o.V. you cannot look at this other than as an  un-intended exploit of the specator feature - making the game more worse in competetive settings.

On public it doesn't matter anyway, as there are so many players around sneak garrs and subs are rarely possible to do.

4000 maps in all sizes. Especially large maps. It does matter. You know how many maps it is possible to take advantage of this on ? Any map which you can build a garr/sub bd lair/sh. battlefront, choke (the snow passage for instance), etc. And secondly, if someone purposely goes to scout a place, they go alone often (not allways), but often. Your argument is flawed in so many ways I cannot state them all.  :-(


It might be nice to have this optionally implemented but it feels like it'll be never used by any competition nor server admin ever.
I agree from a developers pov, especially the spectator issues are not -THAT-important.

summary:
 However - the teamscores i do believe shouldnt be so hard to fix, and would be quite a useful addition to the end-game screen, and would be interesting from a commanders pov aswell.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Shagroth on February 22, 2017, 07:25:00 pm
Yes I know about the low sound that barely changes volume, but its not noticable, and I want to hear it like I hear when I'm hitting something with flux to be absolutely sure I'm hitting my target.

Doesn't matter if it's not stored in DB I play with stats off, I just want to see the amount of healing done, I want to see the impact you can have on the game as a healer, thus making it more rewarding to play a healer and more attractive.
After playing shaman for 1 hour just now i realized there is something missing. :shaman:

A sound that lets you know you are hitting something with shield, maybe just a brigher version of the current shaman shielding sound

Well there is a sound (and i added it along with a purple effect too) when hitting something with shield, but originates at the target, so if you're far away, you may not hear it.


At rewards screen, it only says revives not amount of healing done. Shouldn't be hard to add in healing done?

Even if it would say healing done, the game and the DB only store revives, not healed HP.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 22, 2017, 09:54:35 pm
Owned.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Ale on February 23, 2017, 09:08:54 am
Pretty long topic already... So I'm sorry if it's already been reported but there is another bug I noticed yesterday:

When a worker dies near his colleagues (i.e. when you slay him to free slots for workers elsewhere), the other workers sometimes stop doing whatever they were doing. Can't reproduce it yet but it happened to me alot.

EDIT:
Another bug i noticed is when you mark a group of friendly units as commander and siege weapons or the supporter unit (i.e. tree, flying ballon steampunk thingy) is among them, you cannot access the build menu. You have to unmark these certain units to build sth.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 24, 2017, 12:16:17 am
When a worker dies near his colleagues (i.e. when you slay him to free slots for workers elsewhere), the other workers sometimes stop doing whatever they were doing. Can't reproduce it yet but it happened to me alot.
I'll need more info than that, unfortunately. Once I have it, I'll take a look.

Another bug i noticed is when you mark a group of friendly units as commander and siege weapons or the supporter unit (i.e. tree, flying ballon steampunk thingy) is among them, you cannot access the build menu. You have to unmark these certain units to build sth.
I'll probably take a look.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Nanaa on February 24, 2017, 07:03:45 pm
Revive a pred with shaman > revive animation ends > start healing revived pred as soon as you can > 50% of the time your first couple of heal bursts heal 0 hp > after pred's resurrection animation finishes, heals work normally.

Watch the demo attached. Bug occurs after first revive on pred. Then doesn't occur with scav, stalker, shaman or pred. Then it occurs with pred again, then not with pred... and so fort. I'm not sure if it ever occured with other units than pred.

I have not found any reasonable explanation to this but I guess it's somehow connected to the revived unit's invulnerability frames.

I tested that it doesn't matter if you heal legs or upper body.

This bug has existed a very long time, perhaps even from the beginning.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on February 25, 2017, 12:01:40 pm
Requesting a new simple, feature: Defensive spires/towers have a priority system, and commander can choose to select which targets should be prioritized as targets within the spire/Towers defensive range. Spires/towers can still be distracted by any units if it takes damage.


Example can be prioritize siege units  or prioritize normal units.


An additional note:
 - Would also be very lovely if comm could select a tower and then target a specific player/person within the towers range and the tower would then attack the selected person.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 26, 2017, 01:40:22 am
Requesting a new simple, feature: Defensive spires/towers have a priority system, and commander can choose to select which targets should be prioritized as targets within the spire/Towers defensive range. Spires/towers can still be distracted by any units if it takes damage.
A tower has very limited range, so this feature would only be for behe and mech?

- Would also be very lovely if comm could select a tower and then target a specific player/person within the towers range and the tower would then attack the selected person.
Doesn't that already work? You can give towers attack orders. :p


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: blame! on February 26, 2017, 07:04:28 pm
RE: the  4 hit demo bug, this seemed to appear around the same time the change to behemoth demo damage came in (behemoths require 3 hits rather than 1)

Echoing shag and ale, yeah, hard to reproduce but seems to happen once a week or so..


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: -Lee- on February 27, 2017, 02:25:37 pm
not sure if this has been posted already but i got a suggestion, some of us talked about ingame with rather positive reactions:

Remake/Buff Incinerator

e.g. increase range/aoe (a lot) and damage slightly.

nowadays incinerator isnt used at all. so why not make it actually usefull.



Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 27, 2017, 02:33:03 pm
not sure if this has been posted already but i got a suggestion, some of us talked about ingame with rather positive reactions:

Remake/Buff Incinerator

e.g. increase range/aoe (a lot) and damage slightly.

nowadays incinerator isnt used at all. so why not make it actually usefull.

http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,18550.new.html#new


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on February 27, 2017, 06:02:33 pm
Change the way the mapdownload work. If you world your own map (mapmakers know about for sure) it tries to download the map. The problem about this is that if it's not on the map server from newerth the file will be corrupt. So instead of breaking it just make Savage NOT do anything and proceed to load the map.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 27, 2017, 06:13:15 pm
Mapmakers can just deal with it, it's an automatic map update system after all.

You can:
1. Manually input "devworld mapname" command
2. Manually input "world mapname 0" command
3-4. Make a GUI button where you add param command "devworld mapname" or "world mapname 0"
5-6. Make a .cfg file inside game folder containing "devworld mapname" or "world mapname 0" command, and running it from console with "exec mycfg"
7. Submit your map to Newerth and run "world mapname" command anyway you like

How hard is that? Why do you want to use EXACTLY the one command that updates the map when you got at least 7 other ways to test it?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Nobody on February 28, 2017, 02:28:04 pm
Not sure if this has already been fixed (haven't played in quite a while  :emb:), but sometimes when reviving as shaman you would do the animation/get the sound of it, but not actually reviving, which makes you stuck till the (broken) revive ends. During this time you can also be attacked and killed. I am not sure wether or not it is related to lagg.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on February 28, 2017, 02:59:15 pm
Not sure if this has already been fixed (haven't played in quite a while  :emb:), but sometimes when reviving as shaman you would do the animation/get the sound of it, but not actually reviving, which makes you stuck till the (broken) revive ends. During this time you can also be attacked and killed. I am not sure wether or not it is related to lagg.
Has anyone else seen this lately?
And is there more information around the circumstances when this triggers?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Nobody on February 28, 2017, 03:15:37 pm
Not sure if this has already been fixed (haven't played in quite a while  :emb:), but sometimes when reviving as shaman you would do the animation/get the sound of it, but not actually reviving, which makes you stuck till the (broken) revive ends. During this time you can also be attacked and killed. I am not sure wether or not it is related to lagg.
Has anyone else seen this lately?
And is there more information around the circumstances when this triggers?
Only had this happen with beast shaman so far (I barely play human), not sure if that might be related. Also I cannot remember wether or not you get gold when it happens :S


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Nanaa on February 28, 2017, 04:04:08 pm
Not sure if this has already been fixed (haven't played in quite a while  :emb:), but sometimes when reviving as shaman you would do the animation/get the sound of it, but not actually reviving, which makes you stuck till the (broken) revive ends. During this time you can also be attacked and killed. I am not sure wether or not it is related to lagg.
Has anyone else seen this lately?
And is there more information around the circumstances when this triggers?

I've had this happen once about 2 months ago and I was killed during the revive animation. My guess is that if you start revive and the dead player goes loadout screen on the same frame, this could happen.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on February 28, 2017, 06:48:50 pm
Small bug: vote does not pass (even if gui shows that it has to pass). I guess that it could happen when somebody connects when the vote is otw and gui is not updating.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Nobody on February 28, 2017, 09:10:46 pm
Not sure if this has already been fixed (haven't played in quite a while  :emb:), but sometimes when reviving as shaman you would do the animation/get the sound of it, but not actually reviving, which makes you stuck till the (broken) revive ends. During this time you can also be attacked and killed. I am not sure wether or not it is related to lagg.
Has anyone else seen this lately?
And is there more information around the circumstances when this triggers?

I've had this happen once about 2 months ago and I was killed during the revive animation. My guess is that if you start revive and the dead player goes loadout screen on the same frame, this could happen.
I am quite sure I was able to revive them after the glitched animation finished, which cannot happen when they are in loadout, so I don't think that's the reason.
Btw about balancing discussion, can anybody make a thread? (wanted to ask what people would think of a relocator nerf, like range you have to be in order to use it or something)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on February 28, 2017, 10:52:56 pm
Btw about balancing discussion, can anybody make a thread? (wanted to ask what people would think of a relocator nerf, like range you have to be in order to use it or something)

Nerfing relocator in any way whatsoever will always have the opposite effect: humans will be even more static and prudent.

But anyway, there's like 500 rebalancing threads. Section link below:

Community Driven Patch

It's open season on Savage XR bug fixes, changes and new content. Head on over to submit suggestions, reports and requests HERE (http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/topic,18530.0.html).

For gameplay changes, please post HERE (http://www.newerth.com/smf/index.php/board,126.0.html).


(http://i68.tinypic.com/33omnvk.jpg)

A fair warning to everyone: The community discussing the issues you raised is important, but ultimately, you need to formulate pertinent, precise suggestions, properly explained and backed by compelling arguments from the start. This makes it easier for us to adopt your p.o.v., and add your requests to the TODO list - and not just dismiss them outright for lacking reasons and detail. Or for being illogical, lazy, half-baked ideas :).

Thanks.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Ale on March 01, 2017, 06:13:32 am
Not sure if this has already been fixed (haven't played in quite a while  :emb:), but sometimes when reviving as shaman you would do the animation/get the sound of it, but not actually reviving, which makes you stuck till the (broken) revive ends. During this time you can also be attacked and killed. I am not sure wether or not it is related to lagg.
Has anyone else seen this lately?
And is there more information around the circumstances when this triggers?

I've had this happen once about 2 months ago and I was killed during the revive animation. My guess is that if you start revive and the dead player goes loadout screen on the same frame, this could happen.

I can confirm that. It's a matter of bad timing and easier to reproduce with a slow connection.

Quote
...
I am quite sure I was able to revive them after the glitched animation finished, which cannot happen when they are in loadout, so I don't think that's the reason.
Btw about balancing discussion, can anybody make a thread? (wanted to ask what people would think of a relocator nerf, like range you have to be in order to use it or something)

Actually I have seen that happening aswell (also accompanied by connection problems). Maybe two ways to reproduce the same bug? One cause by spatial the other by temporal discrepancies?

When I'm lagging I often warp around, leap in one direction and get pulled back milliseconds later. Here my theory: By the time you trigger your revive, the game running locally on your computer thinks all conditions for a revive are met and starts the process. Unfortunately the server thinks differently because either the target is already gone or you are not in the place your computer thinks you are.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on March 02, 2017, 03:58:44 pm
If it's not late, I would ask for a client-server option like a 'sv_team_password'.
Without this password people will not be able able to join a team and in the same time that can stay is specs.
Also something like 'sv_spec_chat_only' - leave spec's messages (chat, chat_team and msg) in their spec chat.
These two options could be useful (sometimes  :-P)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on March 03, 2017, 08:13:09 am
If it's not late, I would ask for a client-server option like a 'sv_team_password'.
Without this password people will not be able able to join a team and in the same time that can stay is specs.
When would this actually find use, though? Seems pointless for public servers, and clanwars + private inhouses are already managed well.

Also something like 'sv_spec_chat_only' - leave spec's messages (chat, chat_team and msg) in their spec chat.
I suppose I could add this, but server admins can already do this in python - so any server that wants this is already using this. :?
In fact, in an even more advanced way.


But on that note, this does remind me to check out the local ignore options again. :mrgreen:

EDIT:
Already exists:
cl_filter_public_spec -> if you're in a team, public spec messages are ignored.
cl_filter_public_enemy -> ignore public messages not from your own team, but not spec (counts if you're in spec, too).
cl_filter_public_team -> ignore own teammates' public chat, if they're not officer nor commander.
cl_filter_team_general -> ignore own teammates' team chat, if they're not officer nor commander.
cl_filter_team_officer -> ignore your own officers.
cl_filter_team_commander -> ignore your own commander (why is this even a thing?).

Going to add:
cl_filter_private -> ignore private messages.

Anything else anyone wants?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on March 03, 2017, 10:41:16 am
When would this actually find use, though? Seems pointless for public servers, and clanwars + private inhouses are already managed well.
It could be useful to set cw. servers to let the other people join to watch the game + to block them from joining any team + block all their chat from those who is playing. (I know that somebody can use external teamspeak but w/e).
I think that you can make just a variable 'team_password' without any checkers and leave it for admins to handle it.
I suppose I could add this, but server admins can already do this in python
Something like: for an active gamestate -> sv_events -> chatmessage -> check if uid is not active (talking from specs) -> block message?
Ok, seems possible.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on March 03, 2017, 10:58:12 am
When would this actually find use, though? Seems pointless for public servers, and clanwars + private inhouses are already managed well.
It could be useful to set cw. servers to let the other people join to watch the game + to block them from joining any team + block all their chat from those who is playing. (I know that somebody can use external teamspeak but w/e).
I think that you can make just a variable 'team_password' without any checkers and leave it for admins to handle it.
You've got admins and refs for that, but alright.

Something like: for an active gamestate -> sv_events -> chatmessage -> check if uid is not active (talking from specs) -> block message?
Ok, seems possible.
Yeah, you got it; just like that.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Shagroth on March 03, 2017, 09:59:20 pm
I just had the 3 hit bug on a demo. It could not be more clear, i was swinging 3 times to hit a demo as a predator(lvl4 exactly) on bobbes demo(without any interference, just me and the demo). I even typed /stopdemo but i figured out i was not recording at all, woho.

This bug does exist, 100%

(it exploded after 3 hits)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on March 04, 2017, 07:57:47 pm
I think Savage resurrection had this nice little feature: If you was dead, you would see "A shaman/healer is nearby" on the screen over you dead body (where it says "press L to go to loadout").

I think this would be useful to increase usage of shamans and chaplins in general.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on March 04, 2017, 09:28:44 pm
I just had the 3 hit bug on a demo. It could not be more clear, i was swinging 3 times to hit a demo as a predator(lvl4 exactly) on bobbes demo(without any interference, just me and the demo).
Were there any buildings nearby? Or other items? Anything?
I need something reproduceable.


I think Savage resurrection had this nice little feature: If you was dead, you would see "A shaman/healer is nearby" on the screen over you dead body (where it says "press L to go to loadout").
You mean, it tells you when there's a healer within a certain range of your dead body?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on March 04, 2017, 10:28:01 pm
You mean, it tells you when there's a healer within a certain range of your dead body?

Yes.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on March 05, 2017, 08:45:27 pm
When a siege unit kills a NPC, it drops gold..

suggestion:

Make it such that npc units only drop gold if killed by normal units.


Reason: NPC is often close to garr/sub/lair/sh... I have many times seens balistats or behemoths camp monkits to gain gold, combining it with behecamp close to the nearest spawn point.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Shagroth on March 06, 2017, 08:41:12 pm
I just had the 3 hit bug on a demo. It could not be more clear, i was swinging 3 times to hit a demo as a predator(lvl4 exactly) on bobbes demo(without any interference, just me and the demo).
Were there any buildings nearby? Or other items? Anything?
I need something reproduceable.
Yes there is a sub, and there is also a legionaire with officer flag regen. Can that make it bug?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on March 07, 2017, 01:54:41 am
I just had the 3 hit bug on a demo. It could not be more clear, i was swinging 3 times to hit a demo as a predator(lvl4 exactly) on bobbes demo(without any interference, just me and the demo).
Were there any buildings nearby? Or other items? Anything?
I need something reproduceable.
Yes there is a sub, and there is also a legionaire with officer flag regen. Can that make it bug?

That be weird.

Quote from: OfficerArea State
stateSet radiusTargets -enemy +ally -neutral +unit -building -item -world -team -same_type

it exluces items and buildings.

Quote from: human_demo_pack.object
objSet objclass "item"

demo is set as an object.

Or it's something hardcoded I have no insight to or knowledge about.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on March 08, 2017, 05:25:52 pm
Yes there is a sub, and there is also a legionaire with officer flag regen. Can that make it bug?
That be weird.
The officer state itself not.
But the sub (how close?) and lego (how close, and whose team?) can make a difference.
After all, the stand-on-demo has that setup.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Nanaa on March 08, 2017, 05:50:13 pm
It's the officer flag near demo that causes it, here's demo proof. Great find Shag!

officer nomad nearby - 4 hits
nomad nearby - 3 hits
officer nomad drops demo but goes away (enters sh) - 3 hits
nomad drops demo but officer nomad nearby - 4 hits


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on March 08, 2017, 06:03:18 pm
Wait! Is demo regenerating HP under offi state? :D


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Nanaa on March 08, 2017, 06:32:51 pm
Wait! Is demo regenerating HP under offi state? :D

Yeah that's what I think too and would be a good explanation


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Shagroth on March 08, 2017, 06:49:26 pm
Just crossed my mind as the only simple logical explaination.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on March 08, 2017, 07:03:28 pm
It's the officer flag near demo that causes it, here's demo proof
I tested it myself by checking the hp as comm.
It actually does regenerate health.

As Trig stated (pun intended?), the state itself is not set to apply to items.
And yet here it is, receiving regeneration.  :?

But this means that this issue must have existed for a much longer time already.
Regardless, I'll find out why and how.

EDIT:
According to the code, this bug seems to have existed before XR already.
And according to the 2.00e source (but haven't tested it), this bug may have always existed.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on March 08, 2017, 08:35:22 pm
As Trig stated (pun intended?)

Oh my god, Trig, so pwnd.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: blame! on March 08, 2017, 09:14:34 pm
nice work finding the culprit of the demo bug guys, that is pretty funny. As for it always existing, I doubt that, people would've complained before. I could swear it began after changes to behe demo damage.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on March 08, 2017, 09:28:34 pm
Requesting new label with information in loadout menu:

Besides your current gold, I think it would be useful to see how much gold you have gained yourself in total vs used gold total for that match.

If the usage is greater than the gain, the number could be coloured red, and maybe a small notification could come up every time you request teamgold for something expensive (behe, cata, summ, lego) if the number is red.

In general, ppl and new players in particular, dont give a damn about how much gold they use the second they discover the request-gold feature. I think this can make players more aware of their gold usage.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on March 08, 2017, 09:36:14 pm
As Trig stated (pun intended?)

Oh my god, Trig, so pwnd.
Don't blame me for logic flaws in Savage! :-(


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on March 08, 2017, 09:37:19 pm
nice work finding the culprit of the demo bug guys, that is pretty funny. As for it always existing, I doubt that, people would've complained before. I could swear it began after changes to behe demo damage.

The hits were counted as "-XXX hp" (for example) before, and it took 3 hits for a unit doing 200dmg, for a value of 500, like so:
500-200=300
300-200=100
100-200=dead

Whereas for a scav hitting with (hypothetical value) 150, it took 4 hits:
500-150=350
350-150=200
200-150=50
50-150=dead

But now, every hit would remove 1/3 of HP.
500-500/3=500-167=333
333-167=166
166-167=dead

But if regen interfeered, by the time you hit your 3rd hit, you could have
168-167=1

So that's probably why the bug was visible right now and not before, even though it was present.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on March 08, 2017, 10:38:58 pm
nice work finding the culprit of the demo bug guys, that is pretty funny. As for it always existing, I doubt that, people would've complained before. I could swear it began after changes to behe demo damage.
[Explanation here]
So that's probably why the bug was visible right now and not before, even though it was present.
Yes, logic-wise.

Demos only last 10 seconds, so it was a lot less likely to experience and would be chalked up as a coincidence (either due to level or lag).
But imagine sensors regenerating back to full after an enemy failed to destroy it before being killed - this certainly happened, but no one would notice as you wouldn't be observing them.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on March 12, 2017, 08:02:20 pm
Small feature suggestion:

Land mines / fire wards despawn after 8 minutes if not triggered.

Simply because landmines/firewards are a pain in the ass for any commander to micromanage. I dont think it will affect balance in any major way, since its applied to both teams.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on March 12, 2017, 08:09:23 pm
There is a small bug sometimes that applies to officer marking.

On some maps, if an enemy is below a tree , when you moseover him you dont get his name, like some invicicble wall is denying you the opportunity to mark him. However, you can coil/shoot him still. I believe it is related to the models/objects whatever the trees are.



Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on March 15, 2017, 07:55:18 pm
Small wish if it's not late: deny call self elect vote from the field if you are current commander. They used to abuse it to get fast into the com seat.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on March 16, 2017, 10:09:40 am
Land mines / fire wards despawn after 8 minutes if not triggered.
Simply because landmines/firewards are a pain in the ass for any commander to micromanage. I dont think it will affect balance in any major way, since its applied to both teams.
It'll force players to remember which mines/wards have disappeared so they can reapply them, it's not without negative effect.
See what other people think of this.

On some maps, if an enemy is below a tree , when you moseover him you dont get his name, like some invicicble wall is denying you the opportunity to mark him. However, you can coil/shoot him still. I believe it is related to the models/objects whatever the trees are.
I'll take a look; it's tracing related again.
Can you send me a screenshot where it's easily reproducable so I don't have to guess?

Small wish if it's not late: deny call self elect vote from the field if you are current commander. They used to abuse it to get fast into the com seat.
I suppose.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on March 16, 2017, 05:34:50 pm
Last minute request for a feature:

Can chat boxxes get a constraint such that the same message (included icons), cannot be sent more than two times in  a row? This does of course excluse voice commands such as return to base or similar. Im thinking hand-written messages (and those icons ofc).

Currently there is alot of people spamming icons, constantly. The chat box' size is about 6 messages long, and often people spamm 6 orange faces in a row, taking up all the space in the chat box, slightly annoying if people want to talk.




Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Necrophiliac on March 16, 2017, 05:39:14 pm
FREE THE ORANGE FACE!!!


I hate using command so two more things:

1) Please make the Demo viewer more user friendly. Would love some rewind/fast forward/crop options via a HUD/GUI, then the ability to hide the HUD as well. Maybe allow screenshots too ? :P

2) Please make it so that I can lower my sensitivity below 5 in the options. I can't be the only one who wants that o.o


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on March 16, 2017, 06:48:59 pm
You know that behe-animation hit missing bug?

here's a demo with it happening:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1gpTwfEsdA_REZJR0NyTTBlMUE/view?usp=sharing

the demo is called "Madmod behemoth behemoth animation bug".
The event occurs at 58:20, but slow-mo it from 58:10 to get it all (a sac hit me straight before and MOVED me (like really moved me, like a behe hit...?))

Sorry it happened so late in the demo, happy fast forwarding  :-)


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on March 16, 2017, 08:45:18 pm
We know it, it's network connection related, can't be helped. Happens for every unit but it's more visible the longer the animation attack is because you're not spamming 4x hits/second like in nomad's case. Also, it's 1-hit-1-kill so you'll notice it when it happens to you!

You know preds running around, arms straight down along their body, hitting you with invisible swings? Same thing. Either the hit initiation packet from the laggy client just did not reach the server, or your client (coming from the server, if you're the laggy one), and when the impact packet arrives and the server executes it and your client receives it without knowing there was a swing happening in the first place, there's no way to roll time back and display the animation, is it?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Marbello on March 16, 2017, 08:47:11 pm
Something against this:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
thats so annoying.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on March 16, 2017, 11:19:01 pm
I know its alot of work, but I request a new behe-death animation, or that the dead body dissapears faster atleast.


Currently, when it dies, if you move into the dead body you can see absolutely nothing, its like standing in a bush in first person.


Would be cool if the behe-body would shring when it dies, to some ball or something like that instead, so it doesnt take up too much space on the screen. Besides, it look very ugly, and its very common these days with so much one-way maps played, resulting in dead behe bodies quite often in the way of vision.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on March 17, 2017, 12:30:40 am
Something against this:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
thats so annoying.
Grumpy Marb hatin' on people' laughin'.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on March 17, 2017, 07:34:52 am
Something against this:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
 :lol:
thats so annoying.
It's about server's config:
Quote
// CHAT FLOOD:
set sv_chatConnectInterval 3000 // in msec
set sv_chatFloodCount 7 //Flood protection count before auto mute
set sv_chatCommFloodCount 10 //Flood protection count before auto mute (for commander)
set sv_chatFloodInterval 1 //Interval (in sec) between flood protection checks
set sv_chatFloodPenaltyTime 8 //Penalty mute time (in sec) against chat flooder


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on March 17, 2017, 12:03:29 pm
I suppose I could take a look.
But these are things the SERVER ADMIN is supposed to take care of.  :?

Server admins whined that they don't have enough options and now that they do, they don't bother actually using them. :roll:


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Groentjuh on March 17, 2017, 12:40:11 pm
I can take care of repeating lines (if I want too). No need to put that onto Hakugei's plate. We, serveradmins, have got plenty of features to get rid of that chat issue. Good luck getting JmZ to actually do it though!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Marbello on March 17, 2017, 03:41:03 pm
We, serveradmins, have got plenty of features to get rid of that chat issue. Good luck getting JmZ to actually do it though!  :smitten:

I can create a common swearlist if you want!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Necrophiliac on March 22, 2017, 04:31:48 pm
I know the patch is probably almost finished but I have one last suggestion (well I hope it's my last. I would like to see burrows/new units implemented for ts maps. Currently there's no option to build one o.O and I don't see how it would hurt the game in any way.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on March 22, 2017, 07:04:06 pm
That's something to be tackled at a later date. Updating every mod for the new stuff is a major task in itself, especially after the new content in XR 1.3.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on March 23, 2017, 07:18:20 pm
If it's not late (c)  :-D
Idea appeared to rebuild draw vote a bit.
2 conditions:
- Vote gets % to pass from the players (as is now)
- plus vote passes only if both coms accept it.

And one more small wish: com's vc lacks 'No!/Impossible' command. Every time you have to type 'no' in the chat.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on March 24, 2017, 07:52:48 am
A minor bug:

Most units have two pickup sounds for gold: one when your gold is not full, and another one for when it is. But Behemoth doesn't have the second sound effect, instead Behemoth picking up gold at full gold is silent. Don't remember if that actually applies to all siege units, or if it's only Behemoth.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on March 24, 2017, 10:07:10 am
His head is too far away from the gold bag making the sound!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: eLeMenT on March 25, 2017, 12:12:08 am
After some lovey brotherly banter with Daemon, I decided to post my thoughts on what needed to be added to the game! Hope those get taken into consideration (and get implemented in the next patch):


Votes (most important):
In order to help balance games and reduce stacking on teams, I propose to fix shuffle and even votes.

Even vote
      - Should take all players except commanders into consideration and place them according to K/D ratio into teams, starting from the highest and gradually going down. (K/D ratio may not be the best indicator of skill but it sure seems like the "easier" way to script from my perspective).
      - Should take into consideration how long a player has been in the game IF the game has been going on for more than 5 minutes. If a player was on a team for more than 90% of game time, they will not be switched and the vote will simply go back to its current state - AKA making sure teams have an equal amount of players.
       - Should prevent players from switching teams after it has passed and requires 60% of the votes to pass.

Shuffle vote
       - Taken out of game code, nonexistent.


Movement:
      - Fix a glitch where leaping is hypersensitive to terrain flaws. This sometimes leads to stopping abruptly mid leap.


Weapons:

Incinerator
This has been useless for a really long time, so I propose the following:
      - objset inheritvelocity 0
      - objset damage 8
      - objset refreshTime 60
      - objset velocity 500-500

Snare
Inspired by Djinghis (yes, fuck me)
     - Prevents the use of relocator while snared.

Sixth Sense
      - Acts as a moving sensor with limited range. You should only really be able to know if there are people behind a wall, around a corner and whatnot.

General Game Improvements:
- You may only play on one account, which is linked to your game ID or some hardware on your computer. This will halt most trolls and make them think twice before trolling.
- Installer detects other installation of savage (add registry keys yes!).
Playing without 600 icons may be boring for some so to counteract that:
- Ability to upload your own icon in the options menu.
- Ability to add a custom smiley face (like a spray in half-life games).
- Add the ability to "Use Clan Icon" in options menu if you get bored of your own icon.
- Newerth stats server now acts as an authentication system for clans. You may change clans once every month, meaning you will only have one clan but multiple icons.

Cheers,

eLeMenT


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on March 25, 2017, 07:50:48 am
After some lovey brotherly banter with Daemon, I decided to post my thoughts on what needed to be added to the game! Hope those get taken into consideration (and get implemented in the next patch):
It's 2 months since we started this thread to ask for community's input. This patch goes feature-locked on Sunday, so let's hope there's still time.

Votes (most important):
In order to help balance games and reduce stacking on teams, I propose to fix shuffle and even votes.

Even vote
      - Should take all players except commanders into consideration and place them according to K/D ratio into teams, starting from the highest and gradually going down. (K/D ratio may not be the best indicator of skill but it sure seems like the "easier" way to script from my perspective).
      - Should take into consideration how long a player has been in the game IF the game has been going on for more than 5 minutes. If a player was on a team for more than 90% of game time, they will not be switched and the vote will simply go back to its current state - AKA making sure teams have an equal amount of players.
       - Should prevent players from switching teams after it has passed and requires 60% of the votes to pass.

This seems legit from a ref p.o.v. My only concern is that whenever restrictions occur, people that got fed up leave. A proper even algorithm is good, but blocking rejoining of teams will make those frustrated about the vote either go spec, or leave the game. The result: less players. And all because a couple lamers bailed on their losing team, forcing those that worked for the win be hurled in the team they worked towards destroying for the past hour. Doesn't seem fair to me. If there was a time limit, say 15 minutes after the game started, okay, but hours in, it's real fun breaker and if fun is what you're trying to achieve, then you gotta consider innocent victim's fun as well. Safe for the re-join prevention, it should be done.

Shuffle vote
       - Taken out of game code, nonexistent.
Well, this needs an explanation. Why just not using it instead of removing it?

Movement:
      - Fix a glitch where leaping is hypersensitive to terrain flaws. This sometimes leads to stopping abruptly mid leap.
DEMO RECORDS!

Incinerator
This has been useless for a really long time, so I propose the following:
      - objset inheritvelocity 0
      - objset damage 8
      - objset refreshTime 60
      - objset velocity 500-500
You gotta explain what that does for everyone that is no able or willing to edit their own weapon and still would not figure out what your intention was. That's the point of this thread, making a proper point so that your ideas get understood and adopted, not just throwing random bits.

Snare
Inspired by Djinghis (yes, fuck me)
     - Prevents the use of relocator while snared.
As stated on multiple occasions, ANYTHING like that, that threatens the safe use of reloc, instead of making humans look for more melee fights, and less bailing from duels, will achieve the opposite effect: humans will reloc more often and further away from beasts. Knowing they will not be able to reloc home at will if they get too close, in range of snare, they will try more to stay away from those situations, and reloc pre-emptively and spam ranged more. I mean, why would you walk to certain death, knowing that the only thing that could save you, won't?

Sixth Sense
      - Acts as a moving sensor with limited range. You should only really be able to know if there are people behind a wall, around a corner and whatnot.
This is a good, natural extension of 6th sense effects, gratz. I'll make sure it's on the list of things to be decided by the Council.

General Game Improvements:
- You may only play on one account, which is linked to your game ID or some hardware on your computer. This will halt most trolls and make them think twice before trolling.
- Installer detects other installation of savage (add registry keys yes!).
Playing without 600 icons may be boring for some so to counteract that:
- Ability to upload your own icon in the options menu.
- Ability to add a custom smiley face (like a spray in half-life games).
- Add the ability to "Use Clan Icon" in options menu if you get bored of your own icon.
- Newerth stats server now acts as an authentication system for clans. You may change clans once every month, meaning you will only have one clan but multiple icons.

This is too much, too late. It is such a huge change that it needs proper discussions anyway. It's not like it would stop lamers like the djinghis that inspires you: anybody's got a laptop lying around, next to its desktop PC, so joining the opposite team to spy or spam votes would be just as easy. Not to mention, AGAIN, restrictions lose players. Making it harder for people to play and wondering why they don't?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: eLeMenT on March 27, 2017, 05:02:15 am
I simply wrote my requests and wishes for the new patch, I am realistic though and understand most of it won't make it. I do however hope that the votes and incinerator buff do get implemented. I even did the incinerator testing and gave values so I hope those get taken seriously as it could be a very quick implementation.

Even votes are crucial from a ref point of view and a fair play point of view. Remember, this game's roots are in teamwork! Some won't like it initially but they'll quickly understand why they're there. You might've misread what I wrote as I did mention that I hoped people who have been playing on a team for more than 5 minutes wouldn't get included. It literally can't get any fairer than that! We're not shackling people to the ground and taking away people's freedom or liberty, we're having a fair vote amongst all players to determine whether the teams need to be fixed to encourage fair play!

Shuffles would have to be taken out because if even votes get implemented the way I described then, they would become obsolete. The definition of shuffling cards in a deck is to mix them up, so it would have to do the same thing in savage, to make sense from a definition point of view. However, I believe at that point they would simply become votes that are open for exploitation and trolling. If you mix players randomly into teams, I'm sure no one would be happy and I'm sure players who like to troll would abuse that vote "for the lulz". That could be fixed by also adding time restrictions but it's still not the most useful vote out there. We don't need 2 votes that make games fair! The first one makes more sense and is less random.

I don't have a demo of the movement glitch but it is well known amongst the community. I believe it occurs when the polygons protrude just a tiny bit outside the ground (not obvious to the eye) and leaping preds impact with them, interrupting their leap. That happens on certain maps more than others, I can't tell you exactly which but I do believe that the leap should be fixed in that regard.

Incinerator - I did some testing on npcs and found what I think are better values for the weapon, I balanced them as well. One of the main reasons incinerator is flawed is the "inheritvelocity" value, this means that when you turn, your gun shoots in an arc. It was apparent to me when I used Natsu's graphics mod pack for a little while, I could see how the weapon fired. Turning that value off means the gun shoots in a straight line and is more predictable. However, the gun still won't be perfect so I suggested increasing its velocity so that people can actually hit with it. I changed the refreshTime to 60 because it's prettier than 64 so that's something you might ignore. Finally, a tiny damage boost from 6 to 8 damage, makes it more viable. 2 damage means 10 extra damage per 5 shots, hardly a game changer but certainly a nice little boost. My initial thought was to boost it up to 10 but I kept those values conservative to encourage testing. Shooting in a straight line at npcs has killing speeds comparable to other weapons and moving targets are a lot easier to hit.

The other stuff are just things that I've kept in my head for awhile but would still like to see implemented at some time. I believe implementing the things I mentioned above would be VERY beneficial and a HUGE upgrade to savage. Who knows what might happen if incinerator becomes a viable weapon and if games are fair!

Hasta la vista, baby.  :mrgreen:


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on March 27, 2017, 12:30:01 pm
Even team and shuffle vote changes have been mentioned multiple times, each with their own little tidbits to make it special. The question is which one to use. In most cases, the entire even+shuffle system needs to be recoded - anyone that has seen the code will know why. :-D

Shuffle votes (now and in the future) only work in warmup (ergo, not during the match) and players can easily vote no on it; if the majority votes yes, they get what they wanted. :? It's the same deal with every other vote that may suit the majority, but not every single person. Sometimes you might want a colorful mix of a match.

I don't have a demo of the movement glitch but it is well known amongst the community. I believe it occurs when the polygons protrude just a tiny bit outside the ground (not obvious to the eye) and leaping preds impact with them, interrupting their leap.
The thing about fixing bugs is that you need to be able to reproduce it perfectly; if there is no exact instructions how to do so, it is the proverbial needle-in-haystack.
Also, the terrain doesn't have randomly protruding polygons out of the ground; the terrain is 1:1.
So perhaps you mean little bumps and hills in the terrain, which is what uphill leap is for.
If you mean something entirely different, I'll refer to the first sentence - I need more than this.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Necrophiliac on March 27, 2017, 03:28:55 pm
Seeing as it is too late for most suggestions now, could we have an update on if you're bringing this game to steam?
Is there a plan?
Is it actually going to happen?
Is it a priority?
Obviously it's a lot of work and it's easier said than done, but I'm impatient )


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on March 27, 2017, 04:39:27 pm
We'll release 1.3 in a matter of days. Then we'll round up the TODOs, and see what we can do about steam.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Bullet on March 27, 2017, 08:10:41 pm
I know its too late now,  but I just want to mention it nonetheless,

I deeply miss a feature for commands to deny specific players to play as specific units (siege units in particular).

Today, yesterday, and the day before, and the week before that a bunch of players siege camped close to garrs/subs to various degrees with none whatsoever, offensive purpose, on various maps when no refs was present. This tool gives commanders an option to do so.


Also, would be awesome if it could be vote-called, such as :

"Deny player Djinghis unit: Behemoth".  or bali, cata, summ etc. But not support units or normal units of course.

And voila, he cant use behemoth the rest of the game. Oh, and I picked djinghis as example, as i found it to be a realistic scenario .:wink:


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on March 28, 2017, 09:52:06 am
Probably too late for this suggestion, but I'll throw it out anyway. Perhaps it'll be consider for possible future patches. Making warmups more fun might help in keeping up server population when getting a commander is taking time. Perhaps give duel tech and enable duel mode for the warmups, or give instagib tech and enable instagib mode? Or something on those lines.

e:
even the least effort solution of just giving lego and pred and level 9 would be a big improvement.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on March 28, 2017, 06:38:33 pm
Is it better for people to play aimlessly in warmup, for longer, instead of playing a proper game?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: KingKong_ on March 28, 2017, 07:24:42 pm
Is it better for people to play aimlessly in warmup, for longer, instead of playing a proper game?

Is it better for people to enjoy warmup while waiting for that proper game, instead of leaving the server?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Hakugei on March 28, 2017, 10:47:42 pm
Is it better for people to play aimlessly in warmup, for longer, instead of playing a proper game?
Is it better for people to enjoy warmup while waiting for that proper game, instead of leaving the server?
The reason matches don't start is because no one wants to comm.
Giving players everything they need to enjoy themselves without the need for a comm isn't likely going to change the actual problem. It's a bandaid at best.

Server admins can already do this easily with their own python scripts.
So I suggest asking them if they want it.
If they say no, convince more active players to ask them as well.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Groentjuh on March 29, 2017, 07:52:37 am
My experience is that making warmups fun might actually cause longer warm-ups!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: drk on March 29, 2017, 08:40:56 am
My experience is that making warmups fun might actually cause longer warm-ups!
And that is true.
I'm also against such kind of the warmups. And as Hakugei said: server admins can implement any kind of the 'custom fun warmups'.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on March 29, 2017, 12:00:15 pm
My experience is that making warmups fun might actually cause longer warm-ups!
And that is true.
I'm also against such kind of the warmups. And as Hakugei said: server admins can implement any kind of the 'custom fun warmups'.

So am I. I remember alot of Pulse Refs playing around with ref python while warmup was going. Can't remember anyone getting a comm as long as they did it.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: NuQleO on April 03, 2017, 02:37:27 pm
Hello, i saw SOMA writed about Special store or something like dat, its kinda good idea, but not with account acces.
-We can add new building to human and beast like special store to buy hp regen ring, or stamina regen, something like da, i kinda liked dat thing from savage2 when u could buy some items :)


PS.

it ll be cool if u add skins for like example u reach 15lvl not glowing but get some epic skin, it bring more effect  to game :)?
and maybe some new weapons skins or atleast firing effect :)



PSS.


It ll be nice if u add timer for sac.
And timer for demo

Sorry for bad english :P


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: SOMA on April 04, 2017, 07:15:49 pm
thanks for applying voice command :) i think most of players happen with the new V-CMD

sorry for being inactive in forum, but i just tried new patch and know idea yet where to post my 1st comment which i didin't like

anyway its related to Chat Filter, some words still missing like as* boo*s  and more

also i recommend to change chat filter word (Ni**er) to something else instead of chocolate  :?


Edit: can we do the same filter option if someone try to rename himself to same, ex: /name Ni**er


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: eLeMenT on April 04, 2017, 07:38:41 pm
After playing around for a few days with the patch, here is what I noticed:

Bugs:
- Transports can drive up small trees.
- Not sure EXACTLY how this occurred but based on what Slizer was saying: He spawned from a conflux, which was immobile. He died in battle. I moved the conflux while he was dead. He auto spawned back at the moving conflux, which glitched him out of the map. Here's a demo from comm's point of view: http://www.mediafire.com/file/qpn06ec8f9ec1b9/eLeMenT-xr_assault-04.04.2017-1.demo

Balance suggestions:
- 3 of every major unit is too many, I believe 2 is the perfect amount (conflux, transport, guardian and that flying thinggie). Some have suggested 1 but I think 2 is a good amount.
- Ability to spawn Conflux and Transport from garrisons as well as sublairs. A lot of human bases are designed around locking the stronghold in, which defeats the purpose of transports if they cant be moved out of the base, same goes for beasts.
- Incinerator is still extremely weak vs moving targets so I suggest increasing its shooting velocity or fire rate.
- Behe sprint should be tested at half its current value, it is quite a long sprint right now.

I'm also working on suggestions for the chat filter.

Thanks for the great update, I welcome this change!


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: balatkit on April 07, 2017, 08:24:04 pm
cl_camerajitterforce to display in the options; default value: 0.1
screen color on hit: adjustable in the options


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Trigardon on April 08, 2017, 01:07:26 pm
cl_camerajitterforce to display in the options; default value: 0.1
screen color on hit: adjustable in the options

Not like options are stuffed enough currently... :?


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Necrophiliac on April 16, 2017, 07:11:59 pm
Requests for Daemon (Mapping)
Group of mushrooms (Preferably XR models. ts ones look shit)
Group of glowing mushrooms
One large mushroom
One large glowing mushroom (different colours pink, blue, green ect)
Willow Tree
Climbable Redstone/Goldstone
Giant Redstone/Goldstone crystals without stone
More Dead bushes/Dead Trees
A progess capture flag (Like in SavRez)

Requests for Crashday
Savage Resurrection type HUD
Ping/FPS display for Simple HUD

Requests for Clemens
Players getting stuck in terrain on 32x32 maps.


Title: Re: It's time for a big patch - XR 1.3!
Post by: Daemon on April 16, 2017, 09:37:46 pm
Requests for Daemon (Mapping)
Group of mushrooms (Preferably XR models. ts ones look shit)
Group of glowing mushrooms
One large mushroom
One large glowing mushroom (different colours pink, blue, green ect)
Willow Tree
Climbable Redstone/Goldstone
Giant Redstone/Goldstone crystals without stone
More Dead bushes/Dead Trees

I already planned to do plenty of those for the Caves pack - waiting on Crash to fix the lighting issues!

Requests for Daemon (Mapping)
A progess capture flag (Like in SavRez)

Erm, use the Terminus for that, no? You said you'd make a map with that, anyway! DOO EET!