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Author Topic: Discuss: Outpost & Burrow  (Read 1750 times)
Daemon
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« on: October 12, 2014, 08:28:35 pm »

2nd Generation re-balancing discussions are not meant to result in simple suggestions that merely tweak or change one isolated aspect of the game. Please take into account the overall effect on the game, the stats showing 38% more beast wins, the 1st generation gameplay changes and the need to make as few subsequent changes to compensate as possible.

At the time this post is being written, there has been a widespread acceptance of the new changes and there's actually little, if any, ingame talks about them at all! So don't go proclaiming "this and that will kill the game!" because previous changes obviously didn't. This may be a testimony to the care that's been given to choose small incremental steps over radical changes. Regardless what a few haters, like djinghis, proclaim. They should read the 1st gen threads too.



1st Gen changes:
* Two new buildings have been added (Outpost and Burrow) that act as one-way doors or field resupply stations.
* Outpost and Burrow are constructed in less time so that they become an acceptable alternative to kamikaze runs (ex: 4 nomads build an Outpost, then grab ballis and do a lair run).

Suggestions:
1. Building provides 'gold over time' that is only activated by commander.  (Or only active if TEAM gold is under 50% of team gold. 25k or below in most cases)
2. Make workers be able to enter it as well / or be able to spawn workers for no price.
3. Make them able to build a limited amount of workers at no stone cost (for instance 3, or 5).
4. When repairing the Outpost with workers - it costs 0% funds from teams resources.
5. Have Outpost/Burrow generate ammo/mana and/or health/stamina drops at fixed or random intervals.
6. Change Outpost and Burrow costs to 250 stone + 250gold.
7. Give Outpost and Burrow a button for upgrading to Garrison/Sublair for a reasonable cost.
8. Give Outpost and Burrow an upgrade button that adds a tower-like ranged weapon.
9. Allow Burrow to upgrade its inactive spire into a sort of healing spire that can heal units.
10. Allow the Outpost to self destruct, causing a massive explosion with huge range and damage.

There's no secret that the new buildings were not meant to replace the old spawn points (garrison and sublair). While they add plenty variation to the daring commander's tactics, there's no doubt that they can be improved and become used more often.

Please discuss and remember: YOU HAVE TO MAKE A GOOD CASE FOR WHATEVER YOU'RE TRYING TO CONVINCE US OF!
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HeMi
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« Reply #1 on: December 01, 2014, 03:03:34 pm »

Outpost/burrow is just too cheap and too easy to build,gives beast extreme advantage in map coverage.Ruined balance.
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Daemon
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« Reply #2 on: December 01, 2014, 05:42:09 pm »

Outpost/burrow is just too cheap and too easy to build,gives beast extreme advantage in map coverage.Ruined balance.

[edit]Can you please share those tactics that give beasts extreme advantages and maybe why those tactics cannot be used by humans?

Thank you.

Few people even use them, at all. Ale being one of them, and he's using both outpost and burrow successfully, but even he does not puts them to their full use.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2014, 07:59:56 pm by Daemon » Logged

Oberlus
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« Reply #3 on: September 12, 2015, 03:52:13 pm »

A nice tactic with outposts and sieges that I already say in game (and victory for humans):

Quote
4 nomads build an Outpost, then grab ballis and do a lair run

However, it is true that the higher mobility of beasts makes it easier for them to take advantage of that kind of strategy.
But I haven't see any game in which burrows allow beasts to win over humans no matter what.
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